Ideas for Janice

wintermute · 2013-10-22 11:32:22

@* regarding the post installation scripts..
i have always liked the concept (optimal balance of choice and convenience, plus, it is very much a differentiator from other lightweight distros, makes #! unique, both as a user experience and as a "friendly yet not locked into anyones choice but the user's" kind of thing, functionalitywise or politically) and i do "vote" for taking it a step further..
the installation would be basically debian eight with a preconfigured open box (what i mean is, probably not technically correct, as is now pretty much, i mean conky, tint2, wifi, sound, all that good stuff, with perhaps a bit more "instant customization options" of the look and feel, but it is just fine as it is now (11)) and all that comes "on top of that" (applications) could be a streamlined cli dialogue (just like the scripts now offered).. i personally don't see the point of having any fixed software collection (although the current one is excellent in my opinion, and an argument could be that it is the choice of the basic applications that make for a good part of the distributions identity, i believe that this is mostly the remnant of the way of thinking from the time when a distribution needed to have the base system and the healthy suite of applications (all fitting on a single cd:) due to an actual technological obstacle (the lack of fast enough and omnipresent internet))..
so.. my inclination is toward more, as someone above named it, branching scripts running after the installation of the base system as a model to aspire to for the next #! release.. everything from the choice of a browser to the addition of more exotic applications and perhaps the automated proprietary driver install should be considered (imho) maybe with a "recommended" option present (example, file manager, recommended and most optimized/ tested, traditional if you will: 1) thunar, but there are also 2) nautilus 3) pcfm 4) gentoo, you get the picture..
the challenges of making this "model" that i foresee are the live session, balancing the installation process complexity in a way that the choices and steps needed for setting up the operating system do not become too overwhelming (both as in too many and options that one might not have a clue to what they would need/ prefer), and making sure that even after every possible combination, crunchbang retains a distinct identity, something that it does very well so far in my opinion, a bit of a rarity in the open source world, and something that it should make a top priority in preserving and consider it an asset if you will..
thanks for reading..
i'm confident that whatever direction #! takes, regarding this and many other elements that make it special, it will be superb by the time it reaches the next release.. a discussion between the existing user base, the developer(s) and projections of the "what would a potential new user want/ appreciate" kind can only benefit it..
i'm not about to initiate any sort of a pole on this topic but would encourage leaving opinions here, for example, if you personally would prefer a predefined software collection as it is now to the "multiple choice terminal based post installation" to handle all the applicative software.. have abiword simply there after the install or should the choice of a text processor (not having/ needing/ wanting any being one of the options) be one of the answers to several questions that the system would ask you after the base install right before you start using it??
all this from a user who actually likes the bundle as it is now, agrees with the choices as "optimal", and would choose the most of the software himself..

tamikan · 2013-10-22 13:01:42

The default selection of applications allows users to have a better experience in a "live session"

tamikan · 2013-10-22 14:31:12

tamikan wrote:

gnome-mplayer over vlc simply because when you're listening to online radio which works with both, gnome-mplayer does a better buffering (you need a slow connection to find that out )

Forget gnome-mplayer and keep vlc :just exported an avi file encoded with mencoder in Kino video editor and I couldn't jump in the timeline properly with gnome-mplayer but with VLC it works 100% 8o

Hy · 2013-10-22 20:50:55

RoysoN wrote:

Xchat: No
Pidgin: Yes

Agreed.

Argumento · 2013-10-22 22:46:17

I really like this distro. I tried mint and ubuntu studio but liked #! waaay better. I use my computer mainly for graphics and video, and a lighweight, discrete enviroment is great for that. I dist-upgraded to testing so I'm in Janice already

The only thing I would add to a great distro is Any Color You Like icons presintalled

I hope that development of #! will keep it a great distro. I would like to see the skype and googledocs pipes deleted, since I have a personal dislike of both services. Anyway, the logic in "if anyone wants it, they could apt-get it" is no different from "if anyone doesn't use it, they can delete the menu entry", wich is what I did.

Although I liked devoted distros (like ubuntu studio), I rather use a clean, slim distro and build it the way I need it, even if I end up installing the very same software. Thinking of a #! for gaming kind of defeats the purpose of a lightweight distro.

Nebucatnetzer · 2013-10-23 04:02:28

#! Is great for gaming because it doesn't waste your recourses but leaves it all available to the game.

pvsage · 2013-10-23 08:09:15

I can't remember if it's been suggested yet, but I think it would be a good idea to include apt-listbugs by default.

tamikan · 2013-10-23 12:51:06

-A keybind to upgrade the system
-bleachbit

Linuxephus™ · 2013-10-23 19:29:10

tamikan wrote:

-A keybind to upgrade the system
-bleachbit

sudo apt-get install bleachbit

]:D

Quite simple and most assuredly simply logical.

Last edited by Linuxephus™ (2013-10-23 19:29:46)

Jolla · 2013-10-23 20:34:48

+1 for removing GIMP from the base install and putting it as an option in the post-install script

damo · 2013-10-23 20:50:27

tamikan wrote:

-A keybind to upgrade the system

alias distup='sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade'

or script it and run with a keybind

or run in a terminal with a keybind or from the menu, as explained here

Laudan · 2013-10-23 20:54:30

Adding to the post-install script a whole suite of security-oriented applications.

Sector11 · 2013-10-23 21:57:31

damo wrote:

alias distup='sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade'

We are close:

alias upit='sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade --no-install-recommends'
### Simulate Actions #########################################################
alias supit='sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade --no-install-recommends --simulate'

porkpiehat · 2013-10-23 22:30:51

tamikan wrote:

-A keybind to upgrade the system

This is not a good idea, IMO, unless the keybind runs the upgrade in a terminal. You should always inspect the proposed upgrade before allowing it to continue. I have seen many threads where people say "I ran a dist-upgrade yesterday, and now <blah> is broken. I think the upgrade updated <foo> and <bar> but I'm not sure. What could the problem be?" The problem is that you did not monitor your upgrade.

anonymous · 2013-10-23 23:18:29

porkpiehat wrote:

tamikan wrote:
-A keybind to upgrade the system
This is not a good idea, IMO, unless the keybind runs the upgrade in a terminal. You should always inspect the proposed upgrade before allowing it to continue. I have seen many threads where people say "I ran a dist-upgrade yesterday, and now <blah> is broken. I think the upgrade updated <foo> and <bar> but I'm not sure. What could the problem be?" The problem is that you did not monitor your upgrade.

Upon reading your post, I thought you were describing Arch Linux.

Sector11 · 2013-10-23 23:38:10

porkpiehat wrote:

tamikan wrote:
-A keybind to upgrade the system
This is not a good idea, IMO, unless the keybind runs the upgrade in a terminal. You should always inspect the proposed upgrade before allowing it to continue. I have seen many threads where people say "I ran a dist-upgrade yesterday, and now <blah> is broken. I think the upgrade updated <foo> and <bar> but I'm not sure. What could the problem be?" The problem is that you did not monitor your upgrade.

This is where "--simulate" comes in handy as well as "apt-listbugs"

 23 Oct 13 | 20:30:31 ~
    $ sho apt-listbugs
Package: apt-listbugs
State: installed
Automatically installed: no
Version: 0.1.11
Priority: optional
Section: admin
Maintainer: Francesco Poli (wintermute) <invernomuto@paranoici.org>
Architecture: all
Uncompressed Size: 428 k
Depends: ruby | ruby-interpreter, ruby-debian (>= 0.3.3), apt (>= 0.9.11), ruby-gettext (>= 3.0.2), ruby-xmlparser,
         ruby-httpclient (>= 2.1.5.2-1), ruby-soap4r
Suggests: reportbug, debianutils (>= 2.0) | www-browser | w3m
Breaks: libapt-pkg4.12 (< 0.9.11)
Description: tool which lists critical bugs before each apt installation
 apt-listbugs is a tool which retrieves bug reports from the Debian Bug Tracking System and lists them. Especially, it
 is intended to be invoked before each upgrade/installation by apt in order to check whether the upgrade/installation
 is safe. 
 
 Many developers and users prefer the unstable version of Debian for its new features and packages.  apt, the usual
 upgrade tool, can break your system by installing a buggy package. 
 
 apt-listbugs lists critical bug reports from the Debian Bug Tracking System. Run it before apt to see if an upgrade
 or installation is known to be unsafe.
Homepage: http://alioth.debian.org/projects/apt-listbugs/
 
 23 Oct 13 | 20:30:47 ~
    $

Love that apt-listbugs!

porkpiehat · 2013-10-23 23:52:58

Both --simulate and apt-listbugs are good ideas, but they require that you look at the output. I thought the OP was suggesting a keybind that would let him upgrade his system without monitoring (if you're going to monitor, you don't need a keybind, just an alias like the one you have). As anonymous pointed out, unattended upgrades are more a problem in Arch than Debian stable. So forget I said anything.

On-topic, I will add my vote to the many already suggesting removing GiMP from the live session.

damo · 2013-10-24 02:13:42

porkpiehat wrote:

On-topic, I will add my vote to the many already suggesting removing GiMP from the live session.

Has anyone asked Wilbur about that?

Sector11 · 2013-10-24 15:30:29

porkpiehat wrote:

Both --simulate and apt-listbugs are good ideas, but they require that you look at the output. I thought the OP was suggesting a keybind that would let him upgrade his system without monitoring (if you're going to monitor, you don't need a keybind, just an alias like the one you have). As anonymous pointed out, unattended upgrades are more a problem in Arch than Debian stable. So forget I said anything.
On-topic, I will add my vote to the many already suggesting removing GiMP from the live session.

As tamikan wrote:

tamikan wrote:

-A keybind to upgrade the system

and didn't clarify if it was to run hidden in the background or open a terminal and then run. So your idea of it might being "hidden" has it's merits and taught me something. I would never have considered it running in the background. So it's my opinion that you made a very valid point. I don't use keybindings much beyond copy and paste - I have problems remembering them. And I've learned the hard way that [Ctrl]+q is not the same as [Alt-Gr]+q

But a keybinding could be made the would automatically open the terminal and run the update - dist-upgrade commands, like damo said?

or script it and run with a keybind
or run in a terminal with a keybind or from the menu, as explained here

and my suggesting adding a --simulate and apt-listbugs was an enhancement to the idea.

OPINION: All of these are valid suggestions for Janice and on topic ...

I do however disagree with you about GIMP, struggle as I do with it, I like it.

Off Topic

PS: I wouldn't dare contradict anonymous, I have far too much respect for the man, his knowledge and his decorum on the forums, besides, I know zero about ARCH other than the cool logo.

PPSS if you do get your name change please no GreenFriedTomatoes - VeggiePlatter is cool though.

Peace!

tamikan · 2013-10-24 15:38:43

-keybind to upgrade the system in terminator to monitor the upgrade
-since #! is shipped with pulseaudio and I've discovered how ponies are loved in this community, how about ponymix cli application for volumecontrol: https://github.com/falconindy/ponymix
ponymix

Last edited by tamikan (2013-10-24 15:39:05)

GekkoP · 2013-10-24 15:42:57

^ oh please, NO!
Let's keep these ponies optional.

anonymous · 2013-10-24 17:00:23

GekkoP wrote:

Let's keep these ponies optional.

So I guess thats a vote for putting it into the welcome-script?

GekkoP · 2013-10-24 17:01:05

^ lol, yes, as long as I can't avoid them.

Linuxephus™ · 2013-10-24 17:56:01

Speaking of ponies...has anyone noticed the theme available in the Notification Settings...?

CSCoder4ever · 2013-10-24 18:17:07

I love options.

Linuxephus™ wrote:

Speaking of ponies...has anyone noticed the theme available in the Notification Settings...?

I have. lol

Last edited by CSCoder4ever (2013-10-24 18:17:53)

CrunchBang Linux

SEARCH

#951 2013-10-22 11:32:22

Re: Ideas for Janice

#952 2013-10-22 13:01:42

Re: Ideas for Janice

#953 2013-10-22 14:31:12

Re: Ideas for Janice

#954 2013-10-22 20:50:55

Re: Ideas for Janice

#955 2013-10-22 22:46:17

Re: Ideas for Janice

#956 2013-10-23 04:02:28

Re: Ideas for Janice

#957 2013-10-23 08:09:15

Re: Ideas for Janice

#958 2013-10-23 12:51:06

Re: Ideas for Janice

#959 2013-10-23 19:29:10

Re: Ideas for Janice

#960 2013-10-23 20:34:48

Re: Ideas for Janice

#961 2013-10-23 20:50:27

Re: Ideas for Janice

#962 2013-10-23 20:54:30

Re: Ideas for Janice

#963 2013-10-23 21:57:31

Re: Ideas for Janice

#964 2013-10-23 22:30:51

Re: Ideas for Janice

#965 2013-10-23 23:18:29

Re: Ideas for Janice

#966 2013-10-23 23:38:10

Re: Ideas for Janice

#967 2013-10-23 23:52:58

Re: Ideas for Janice

#968 2013-10-24 02:13:42

Re: Ideas for Janice

#969 2013-10-24 15:30:29

Re: Ideas for Janice

Off Topic

#970 2013-10-24 15:38:43

Re: Ideas for Janice

#971 2013-10-24 15:42:57

Re: Ideas for Janice

#972 2013-10-24 17:00:23

Re: Ideas for Janice

#973 2013-10-24 17:01:05

Re: Ideas for Janice

#974 2013-10-24 17:56:01

Re: Ideas for Janice

#975 2013-10-24 18:17:07

Re: Ideas for Janice

Board footer