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#126 2012-03-10 22:00:47

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^^ thanks damo...


Be eggsalad to each other.

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Be excellent to each other!

#127 2012-03-10 22:10:52

CBizgreat!
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2011-07-27
Posts: 1,865

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

A seat for every butt ... hey I like it,  ... it's catchy. Lol ... yep dubois called it, you've made the front pg of the #! forums, 2500 and growing. Keeps up am gonna have to start bugging ya for an autograph 2Many. wink


Some common cbiz abbreviations. This will save me time and yet @ same time tell folks what the babble is supposed to mean.

Vll ! = ( Viva la gnu/Linux !)    Vl#!! = ( Viva la #! !)    Last but not least, UD ... OD ! = ( Use Debian ... or die !) tongue

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#128 2012-03-10 23:10:02

punk_physicist
#! CrunchBanger
From: ~/
Registered: 2011-05-02
Posts: 160

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

2ManyDogs wrote:

I might need more of the lurkers to at least tell me they're lurking (100 replies responses, 2507 views? WTF?)

Lurking on the edge of my seat...

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#129 2012-03-11 00:56:54

orionthehunter
#! Constellation
From: Japan
Registered: 2011-04-09
Posts: 967
Website

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

I'm lurking as well.  You're good at providing teasers, one thing I suggest is trying to keep your posts structured very parallel-like to each other so they're easy to browse and compare.  I think you are to some extent already.

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#130 2012-03-11 06:47:40

ivanovnegro
Ivan #000000
From: unstable madness
Registered: 2011-06-02
Posts: 5,432

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

@2Many: Interesting TWM post, thanks for this one.

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#131 2012-03-11 08:53:07

cJones
#! Junkie
From: Oregon
Registered: 2012-02-21
Posts: 447

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

2ManyDogs wrote:

All righty then...

Hahaha, that reminded me of Ace Ventura! (especially sense you're a vet and what not)...anyways, another great review, good job


d(o_O)b

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#132 2012-03-11 09:47:11

doxanthropos
#! Member
From: Germany
Registered: 2011-03-30
Posts: 69

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

2ManyDogs wrote:

I might need more of the lurkers to at least tell me they're lurking

Here is another lurker. Your journey through the world of window management is intriguing. It has been a while since I seriously tried a window manager and I settled myself with awesome, but now that I follow your steps I can't say where I might end up.

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#133 2012-03-11 13:01:51

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Day seven. Evilwm. The home page says "we sold our souls to the window manager."

Evilwm 1.0.0 is in the repos, just apt-get install. It does not create a .desktop file, so you will need to create one; it's not hard:

cd /usr/share/xsessions
sudo nano evil.desktop

put this in the file:

[Desktop Entry]
Name=evilwm
Type=Application
Exec=/usr/bin/evilwm

Save the file but don't log out yet. First you should read the man page for evilwm (just type "man evilwm"). It's short, and you will want to read it before you start evilwm. Evilwm has no built-in menus, so you need to know at least how to start a terminal before you start the window manager, and the man page covers this and some other useful information. According to the man page, ctrl-alt-return starts a terminal. Now we're ready.

After you log in, you see a big empty black screen. Mouse clicks do nothing. Good thing we know how to start a terminal. Ctrl-alt-return (kind of reminds me of the Windows three-finger salute). With a terminal open, it looks like this:

2012_03_10_104504_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

This Is Minimalist! No window title bar, no panel, no menus. Good practice for the tiling window managers we will be looking at soon. Start another terminal and play with moving the windows and switching focus. Focus follows the mouse pointer, Alt+left click raises a window to the top of the stack, and moves the window as long as you hold down the left button. Alt+right click lowers the window. Alt+middle-click resizes the window. There are also handy keyboard shortcuts for moving and resizing windows, and shortcuts to move windows to the four corners of the screen. Like many other window managers, windows can have the focus and be anywhere in the stack (giving a window the focus does not automatically raise it to the top of the stack). As I've used more window managers with this behavior I've gotten used to it, and I even like it now.

There are eight workspaces (or "virtual desktops") and ctrl-alt-<n> moves to workspace <n>. You can move a window to a different desktop; this is a little different. You "fix" the window you want to move (with ctrl-alt-f), move to the workspace with ctrl-alt-<n>, then "unfix" the window with cltr-alt-f again. It feels like packing the window with you and dropping it off at its new home. "Fixed" windows have a blue border instead of gold.

One interesting thing about evilwm is that it has no built-in logout function. To log out, you have to kill X (it's not enough just to kill evilwm, although it sounds like it should work). Just "sudo pkill X". You can also put something (like xclock) in your start script after you start evilwm; then killing xclock will exit back to the login.

Conky works well, but the panels (fbpanel, tint2) do not.

Configuration

Configuring evilwm is a little different too. It doesn't really use a config file, but it has a bunch of command-line options, including options to change the window border width and color, and "mod masks" (the keys used as modifiers for other keys and mouse clicks). You can also specify what terminal emulator you want evilwm to use. Here's what I have now:

evilwm -nosoliddrag -term sakura -mask1 mod4

This tells evilwm I want to use outline window drag instead of opaque (the window changes to an empty box when I drag it; I need to do this on my Celeron test box). I use sakura as my terminal emulator, and I changed mask1 to the Windows (or super) key, also known as Mod4. Now instead of ctrl-alt-something I can just type super-something. Super-return starts a terminal, super-f fixes and unfixes a window, super-2 moves me to workspace 2, etc. In the latest version of evilwm you can also put these options in a config file in your home folder, but the version in the Debian repos does not have this feature.

If you want to use custom command-line options or start anything with evilwm (set the background, start conky) you will need to use a startup script. Refer to the flwm review for more information on this.

You can also add custom keybindings using xbindkeys. This is described in detail in the Debian user forum or the Gentoo wiki, but briefly you need to apt-get install xbindkeys (if you don't already have it) and then set up a .xbindkeysrc file in your home folder. Xbindkeys will read this file and pass the appropriate information to evilwm. It sounds complicated, but it's really not. I set up keybindings for gmrun and dmenu, and my usual favorite apps.

Once I made these simple configuration changes evilwm was even easier to use. Here is what I ended up with:

2012_03_11_042657_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

What I Like About It

Simple, simple, simple. Really easy to use, easy to configure. Minimalist. It feels like a tiling window manager but looks like a stacker. I like its name.

What I Don't Like About It

Not much, especially after I changed mask1 to mod4 and learned how to use xbindkeys to add key bindings. The middle button on my wireless mouse doesn't work for moving windows (the wired mouse on my test machine works fine) and I have not yet figured out how to re-map the move function (a minor annoyance, because the move keybindings work very well). The panels don't work (but panels are bloat smile ).

Links

"man evilwm" but you read that already, right?
evilwm home page
evilwm in the Debian user forum
evilwm in the Arch wiki
evilwm in the gentoo wiki (also describes how to use xbindkeys)

Tomorrow: WindowLab

back to the top

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-20 21:07:15)


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#134 2012-03-11 14:00:34

rhowaldt
#!*$%:)
Registered: 2011-03-09
Posts: 4,396

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

seems it's not all in a .config file somewhere big_smile

really good review, i liked to read it. also really nice how evilwm (by accident?) paves the way for the tiling WMs you're going to be looking at later. great great great. and evilwm looks like a nice WM too!

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#135 2012-03-11 14:03:27

ivanovnegro
Ivan #000000
From: unstable madness
Registered: 2011-06-02
Posts: 5,432

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

@2ManyWMs: Great. But the Debian User Forums link points also to the Arch Wiki. wink

Last edited by ivanovnegro (2012-03-11 14:03:57)

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#136 2012-03-11 14:06:44

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

ivanovnegro wrote:

@2ManyWMs: Great. But the Debian User Forums link points also to the Arch Wiki. wink

Thanks. I fixed the link, but the Debian forum is "undergoing maintenance" right now.

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-11 14:07:00)


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#137 2012-03-11 14:41:00

zengrapefruit
#! Junkie
Registered: 2009-12-11
Posts: 281

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

I'd post to let you know I'm lurking but, in doing that, do I not then cease to be a lurker? big_smile

A brilliant read and an excellent contribution to the CB community.

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#138 2012-03-11 14:47:23

kri5
#! Die Hard
From: L.G.C. UK
Registered: 2011-11-10
Posts: 568

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Another excellent review!

These bare bones minimalist WM's look interesting but to be honest they scare me a little. lol
Sticking with Openbox for now, looking forward to the tiling WM's though, keep up the good work. wink


#! Waldorf - 64bit - Xfce

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#139 2012-03-11 14:47:27

Forthy
#! CrunchBanger
Registered: 2012-01-16
Posts: 226

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Quick note to say I'm still here too!

I might have to give evilwm a go - I like the way you described it as 'feels like a tiler'.  I'm kind of loving tiling right now, so be interested to see if this 'floats my boat' (pun intended).

On a side note - thanks for all the hard work.  Just 'cos people are lurking, doesn't mean they do not appreciate the effort smile

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#140 2012-03-11 14:49:30

pucko
Member
From: ‽
Registered: 2012-03-11
Posts: 39

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Getting the post count up. wink

I'm really enjoying this thread and looking forward to whatever comes next...
Like the look of evilwm, but it's the name that makes me want to try it.

Keep up the good work 2ManyDogs! I envy your quest.

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#141 2012-03-11 16:12:19

gutterslob
#! Resident Bum
Registered: 2009-11-03
Posts: 3,207

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

@2Dog

Would be better to suggest using ~/.evilwmrc instead of using the "executable + variables approach". Keeps things cleaner (I personally dislike seeing long lines in htop). Also saves time when you want to play with different settings, especially for those who don't rely on ~/.xinitrc

Probably stated in one of the guides you linked, but still thought I'd mention it.


Point & Squirt

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#142 2012-03-11 16:14:55

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

I tried ~/.evilwmrc, but I could not get it to work. I don't think it works in version 1.0.0 (pretty sure I read that somewhere), and that's what's in the repos. I mentioned that in the review. Does it work for you in v1.0.0?

2ManyDogs wrote:

In the latest version of evilwm you can also put these options in a config file in your home folder, but the version in the Debian repos does not have this feature.

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-11 16:25:02)


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#143 2012-03-11 16:25:11

gutterslob
#! Resident Bum
Registered: 2009-11-03
Posts: 3,207

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^Ah, I see.
I'm not on my netbook (only remaining Debian install I have running) right now, so I can't verify. Highly probable I have a newer version from Git or something.

Edit:
A bit off-topic, but I notice many EvilWM users don't bother switching/using virtual desktops and just prefer the old fashioned Mod + Tab to switch between applications.  Part or the reason might be because ultra-spartan WMs like this don't have a workspace display, nor (as far as I know) any ability to parse workspace info to conky or dzen2. Terminal multiplexers like Screen, Tmux or Dvtm are highly useful for CLI work in this case. That way you keep all your terminal work in a single window. Maybe a topic for another thread.

Last edited by gutterslob (2012-03-11 16:26:31)


Point & Squirt

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#144 2012-03-11 16:30:30

nore
>2^9
From: Lakeland
Registered: 2009-11-28
Posts: 740

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

2ManyDogs wrote:

I might need more of the lurkers to at least tell me they're lurking (100 replies responses, 2507 views? WTF?)

It's your show, I was just watching. I get exhausted even for reading all this stuff. Should we extract a wiki article of this thread when you have finished the 30th WM?

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#145 2012-03-11 16:35:48

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

@gutterslob: yeah, I was thinking about that, it would be easy to lose an app somewhere in the desktops with no display. I mentioned the desktops because they're there, but I probably would not use them either.

I'm not trying to tell people how to use these things (I don't have anywhere near enough experience with any of them). Just trying to give a little taste of each to encourage people to branch out.

Thanks for the feedback.

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-11 16:36:57)


Be eggsalad to each other.

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#146 2012-03-11 17:01:48

safetycopy
urban legend
From: The Chatsubo
Registered: 2010-04-03
Posts: 1,311

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^ I've been reading and enjoying your posts, too - I'm just waiting for the tilers smile


i wonder if i missed the warning
Skinny Puppy, Love in Vein

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#147 2012-03-11 18:00:32

ivanovnegro
Ivan #000000
From: unstable madness
Registered: 2011-06-02
Posts: 5,432

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^ The tilers, that's where the #!'ers heart beats. smile

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#148 2012-03-11 18:08:08

kri5
#! Die Hard
From: L.G.C. UK
Registered: 2011-11-10
Posts: 568

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

I'm currious do people who use tilers (and the other lighweight WM's mentioned) do so because they have low spec/old hardware or are you running some blazingly fast super computer? wink


#! Waldorf - 64bit - Xfce

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#149 2012-03-11 18:09:26

gutterslob
#! Resident Bum
Registered: 2009-11-03
Posts: 3,207

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

@Ivan
All you nerds and your tilers roll

*boots SithWM*


@kri5
My fastest desktop is an i7 based rig. Slowest is probably the netbook (Atom)
All run tilers. Judge me as you see fit.

Last edited by gutterslob (2012-03-11 18:12:42)


Point & Squirt

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#150 2012-03-11 18:31:43

ivanovnegro
Ivan #000000
From: unstable madness
Registered: 2011-06-02
Posts: 5,432

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

@kri5: It is fun and yes @Slobbers I have glasses... smile Next year I will boot into IvanWM.

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