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#26 2010-06-28 20:42:53

winotree
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 548

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Because they can?

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#27 2010-06-28 20:58:01

Tunafish
#! Die Hard
From: the Netherlands
Registered: 2010-03-07
Posts: 1,204

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

winotree wrote:

Because they can?

Doh... of course... why didn't i think about that?
smile


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#28 2010-06-28 21:08:12

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

^ → Hahahaha Good one - Because they can.  And true too.

Tunafish wrote:

It doesn't matter to me if i have something to hide or not... the question for me is why they (google, bing, the government, the rail company, the library, etc) want to keep all this information about me. If it's not important, why do they keep it?


"Information" is BIG business today they get buying trends that help companies decide whether or not to mass produce a product or make decision on where and how to invest.  Not all the information is actually identifiable to "John Q. Citizen" as a name.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_information

http://www.rba.co.uk/sources/

Welcome to the real world Neo!

Last edited by Sector11 (2010-06-28 21:20:23)


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#29 2010-06-28 21:32:49

Tunafish
#! Die Hard
From: the Netherlands
Registered: 2010-03-07
Posts: 1,204

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Sector11 wrote:

Welcome to the real world Neo!

I really don't like that statement...
like you i live in the real world... which doesn't mean i have to agree with everything that happens around me...

Also 'because they can' isn't much of an answer of course. I can do lots of things, like stealing, reading my girlfriends diary, throwing oil in the sea, or worse... but i don't do them.


sed 's/stress/relaxation/g'
Privacy & Security on #!

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#30 2010-06-28 21:42:48

winotree
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 548

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

....Also 'because they can' isn't much of an answer of course. I can do lots of things, like stealing, reading my girlfriends diary, throwing oil in the sea, or worse... but i don't do them.

Which of course is my point.  I was being ironic.  The fact that they [whoever they are] do it does not, in any sense of the word, make it right. 

Before any harm is done through misunderstanding I think I'll just drop out of the thread.  wink

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#31 2010-06-28 22:04:48

Zen:Core
#! CrunchBanger
From: Bleeding Kansas
Registered: 2009-11-09
Posts: 195

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

It's impossible for me to seem unbiased on this as I have a Google phone and I use the Google and it's services quite a bit, but here goes.

This is the internet. If you want to be anonymous on the internet then good luck. It's a brave new world. Has anyone here ever seen those banners people put in their signatures that show you your IP, OS and what web browser you're using? That's kind of scary to me. Google knowing what I'm into isn't so scary. As a company I trust them and coming from me that says a lot. I'm the type of person that never trusts anything that is larger than I am. Corporate, Government, Religion; all of these are large entities that I have no trust for what so ever. The problem with these entities is that they are ultimately controlled by man and every man has an agenda and frequently those agendas only benefit one person. The guy in charge and his interests.

There is a lot of evil in the world. Companies like Wal-Mart, Bank of America and others taking out life insurance policies on there employees hoping they die, so they can add a few shillings to their coffers at years end. Let's also not forget BP's "little people" speech and the fact that little if any assistance has been given to the people of Alaska since the Exxon Valdez oil spill. So, before you decide that just one entity is evil ask yourself the questions I always ask myself, "Do any of these people actually care about me? Do they care if I live or die? Succeed or fail? Do they care if I approve of their practices?"

I base my trust for Google on the fact that they treat there employees well, sponsor open source projects and seem to actually care about the world around them and how they impact it. In the video it talked about some class action lawsuits. While it vaguely touched on them, does everyone understand that in a class action lawsuit there is only one winner? The lawyer/ firm in charge of the lawsuit. I've seen too many class action lawsuits that never benefited anyone except the lawyer. This isn't Bobby Joe Kramer standing up and saying "Google ruined my life and now I want paid for my pain and suffering." I agree with people who say if you're ashamed of it don't do it. If you're doing something that you think is so vile that you need to hide it away then you probably shouldn't be doing it. Wouldn't it be nice if even the evil doers couldn't hide. Isn't that what's happening? Google not keeping it's owns actions private now serving as fodder for this conversation?

With anything you can spin it to seem however you want with misinformation, propaganda and sensationalism. So, who is the evil party here? Has anyone felt the direct effects of Google's new world order? Who here still shops at Wal-Mart even though we know how evil they are? The only other issue I really see and this is playing Devil's Advocate, but what is everyone so afraid of? Really what's the deal?

"Google put me on Google Maps walking out of an Adult Video store and now my reputation is tarnished." Sorry man, I wish it would have been me. Oh no, I'm on Google maps walking out of an Adult Video store. Yeah, I was getting something with Volume 6 in the title.

"Google maps has naked pictures of my children on it." Why were your kids naked outside in public in the first place. Parents of the year everybody!

C'mon what's the fear. I see the direct world around me as a fear blanket. Here in America we're afraid of everything apparently. I'm scared that I won't have a job tomorrow. I'm scared to send my kids to school. I'm scared of the water. Terrorists. Gangs. Drugs. And now Google!

Don't worry. You only have 80 or so years to worry about such things. Then the next generation can clean up our mess and make their own. wink


|My Band: 12 Honest Men|

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#32 2010-06-28 22:16:41

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Tunafish wrote:
Sector11 wrote:

Welcome to the real world Neo!

I really don't like that statement...
like you i live in the real world... which doesn't mean i have to agree with everything that happens around me...

Also 'because they can' isn't much of an answer of course. I can do lots of things, like stealing, reading my girlfriends diary, throwing oil in the sea, or worse... but i don't do them.

YOU don't do them, others do.  Hense my statement "Welcome ..." Like it or not this is the world we live in. This is why I said earlier:

Sector11 wrote:

It's a vicious circle - I think I'll get off that part and just live as best I can.

winotree wrote:

....Also 'because they can' isn't much of an answer of course. I can do lots of things, like stealing, reading my girlfriends diary, throwing oil in the sea, or worse... but i don't do them.

Which of course is my point.  I was being ironic.  The fact that they [whoever they are] do it does not, in any sense of the word, make it right. 

Before any harm is done through misunderstanding I think I'll just drop out of the thread.  wink

I will be joining winotree.  Use Google if you want or do not use Google, it is your choice.

So long and thanks for all the fish!

Last edited by Sector11 (2010-06-28 22:22:44)


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#33 2010-06-29 02:04:07

Schadt91
#! CrunchBanger
From: Prescott, AZ
Registered: 2010-04-27
Posts: 159

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

No; I am not afraid of Google.

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#34 2010-06-29 04:02:18

johnraff
nullglob
From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2009-01-07
Posts: 4,148
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

This is all unknown territory and we don't know how it's going to turn out. Trusting Google though, isn't really enough. Imagine a future Bush-type admin forcing them to cough up all the data they have on some topic/person/whatever...

I don't like the argument "If you do nothing wrong, you've got nothing to fear" which is also used to justify tv cameras. Some day that will be turned against you by someone with a different idea of right & wrong from you.

The box is open now, and we'll just have to see if governments can keep the abuse of information under any kind of control. Doesn't hurt for the rest of us to be aware of the issues.


John
--------------------
( a boring Japan blog , Japan Links, idle twitterings  and GitStuff )
#! forum moderator    BunsenLabs

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#35 2010-06-29 07:07:19

Tunafish
#! Die Hard
From: the Netherlands
Registered: 2010-03-07
Posts: 1,204

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

winotree wrote:

Which of course is my point.  I was being ironic.

I desperately need a course 'reading irony in english language'... smile

edit: or maybe a course 'noticing irony in general' or 'how to keep your head cool on the internet' or whatever...

Last edited by Tunafish (2010-06-29 07:12:15)


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#36 2010-06-29 13:09:31

winotree
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 548

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Tunafish wrote:
winotree wrote:

Which of course is my point.  I was being ironic.

I desperately need a course 'reading irony in english language'... smile

edit: or maybe a course 'noticing irony in general' or 'how to keep your head cool on the internet' or whatever...

And I need to learn not to wear my emotions and opinions on my sleeve for the whole world to see.  It's another day.

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#37 2010-06-29 13:33:56

benj1
Wiki Wizard
From: Yorkshire, England
Registered: 2009-09-05
Posts: 1,084

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

pvsage wrote:

My 2¢:

The video ends with "Trying very hard not to be evil" and an approximation of the mask that represents Anakin Skywalker's transformation into Darth Vader.  This is a faulty analogy, unless they're suggesting that some outside force (perhaps another corporate entity) is corrupting Google in the way that Emperor Palpatine/Darth Sidious turned Anakin toward the Dark Side.  So are they suggesting that there is a Bigger Bad pulling Google's strings?

lol, so you have an issue with the flawed analogy of there being no 'Emperor' figure, but non with google being compared to darth vader, murderer, traitor and all round second evilest person in the galaxy?

ps, i nominate stallman to be Chewbacca wink


@pablokal
duckduckgo looks good, ill have to take a closer look


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#38 2010-06-29 13:49:34

winotree
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 548

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

The only issues I had with this duckduckgo search engine was its insistence on embedding its own folders into my personal user files.  That's not my idea of friendly.  sad

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#39 2010-06-29 13:56:03

Nicky
#! CrunchBanger
From: Paris (France)
Registered: 2009-04-05
Posts: 172

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

It also exist this to search on internet: http://www.yauba.com/

I didn't test it, so I don't know if it is good or not, but it seems to respect your privacy at least big_smile

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#40 2010-06-29 13:58:49

evilplaymobils
Member
Registered: 2010-06-26
Posts: 24
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

i think we kinda missed the point here.

the thing isn't about whether WE want to provide our personal information(and who knows what else) to google(or any other company/people) or not.
the thing is why THEY want our personal information.

think about it: we have been manipulated,serving us useless tv-shows and information, leaving us no time(or the will) to think for ourselves,to actually DO something for ourselves.
the worst thing is that they have hypnotized us; we think we are somehow educated,when in fact most of us are not.

until now,what they have achieved is really big:
they made us scared and they can control us:

they say "give us your personal information, and you'll be able to use our services(which we need) for free"
and we provide everything to them,trusting them,without even considering what they need them for and what they can do with them.

for instance,read this article from guardian: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2006/au … rchengines

i'm not only talking about google or yahoo, but the thing is that we are trapped.
think to yourself,if you had a company,wouldn't you want to be really successful and take over the world?
and when you manage that,you literally won't know when to stop.

what i am saying is that the solution isn't that simple.
and me myself am as confused as i can be.
but we must find a way to escape from all this.
i loved google(not knowing how the whole thing works),but after what i read lately,i am furious.
i keep thinking,if we change google to "something else",how do we know that that "something else" isn't involved in the same filthy shit as google?

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#41 2010-06-29 15:10:13

Tunafish
#! Die Hard
From: the Netherlands
Registered: 2010-03-07
Posts: 1,204

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

I would like to give this thread a positive swing... or actually i would like to start a new thread...
' Tips for privacy and security' a thread where we collect all this usefull info (search engines, addons, firewalls, etc).
The motto: "if you like it, use it' smile
I'll start it here: http://crunchbanglinux.org/forums/post/74826/


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#42 2010-06-29 16:41:06

pvsage
Internal Affairs
From: North Carolina
Registered: 2009-10-18
Posts: 13,970

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

@benj1 - the only problem I have with Darth Vader is Mannequin Skywalker's performance. tongue  "He was seduced by the Dark Side of the Force"?  More like bludgeoned into it by Palpatine...yet another example of "break the cutie".  Obi Juan's insistence on his becoming a Jedi didn't help...

I don't think Stallman's right for Chewie; something tells me that character would never eat something from his foot. lol

As for the whole Google thing, I think there are bigger things to fear:  DWI, DWT (driving while texting), Britney Spears...

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#43 2010-06-29 16:48:34

winotree
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 548

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

tNHM4eA

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#44 2010-06-29 17:03:52

evilplaymobils
Member
Registered: 2010-06-26
Posts: 24
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

pvsage wrote:

As for the whole Google thing, I think there are bigger things to fear:  DWI, DWT (driving while texting), Britney Spears...

things such as "driving when texting" are sure things to fear and to avoid.
these can lead to danger and to physical death.

but as far as the google thing is concerned,we're not talking about physical death, we are talking about the "death of our freedom".

maybe i didn't put it correctly,but you know what i mean.

Last edited by evilplaymobils (2010-06-29 17:05:06)

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#45 2010-06-29 19:11:03

benj1
Wiki Wizard
From: Yorkshire, England
Registered: 2009-09-05
Posts: 1,084

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

pvsage wrote:

@benj1 - the only problem I have with Darth Vader is Mannequin Skywalker's performance. tongue  "He was seduced by the Dark Side of the Force"?  More like bludgeoned into it by Palpatine...yet another example of "break the cutie".  Obi Juan's insistence on his becoming a Jedi didn't help...

Ok, so essentially you fear google turning into george lucas, churning out poor imitations of former glories, and then basing a cartoon on the resulting computer game tie-in of said poor imitation?

On a mental health note, you realy should move on, j** j** b?#ks was unleashed well over a decade ago, it isn't healthy, anger leads to hate, hate leads to the dark side wink



rule 36 of the internet: "Any thread of sufficient length will inevitably discuss the failings of George Lucas.... and then be followed by a picture of Britney Spears"


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#46 2010-06-29 21:14:52

pablokal
#! CrunchBanger
From: Nijmegen, Holland
Registered: 2009-12-11
Posts: 232
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Look here http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=53046  they're talking about it over at Debian Forums, too.

Thanks for that link, interesting thread with great suggestions.
This article is also very informative: http://www.privacyinternational.org/art … 347-553961
Recommended!!


GNu/Linux: Nu nog schoner: http://linuxnogschoner.blogspot.com/  Dutch

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#47 2010-06-29 22:16:56

evilplaymobils
Member
Registered: 2010-06-26
Posts: 24
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

pablokal wrote:

Look here http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=53046  they're talking about it over at Debian Forums, too.

Thanks for that link, interesting thread with great suggestions.
This article is also very informative: http://www.privacyinternational.org/art … 347-553961
Recommended!!


really interesting what you found there..looks like all these companies do not think much of us (not to say that they did at first place).

you have to read this 2008 article,when google announced some "changes" concerning the user privacy: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13739_3-10038963-46.html
they are taking advantage of the fact that not many people are efficient with cookies and ips, and they are trying to fool us.

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#48 2010-06-29 22:43:58

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

pvsage wrote:

As for the whole Google thing, I think there are bigger things to fear:  DWI, DWT (driving while texting), Britney Spears...

Hear hear!  Love that DWT!

winotree wrote:

tNHM4eA

Yes your teeth are clean! The little green speck is gone  big_smile


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#49 2010-06-29 23:19:22

Awebb
The Singularity
Registered: 2009-07-23
Posts: 2,812

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

When the web rebels talked about the future of Web 3.0, when the Tier 1 providers were talking about reforming the internet into some kind of pay tv with different channels and full content control, noone really listened. Those little sheeps only laughed and said: No, that won't happen, nah... And now check out, what Apple and Google and others are trying to establish: Micropayed content with full control . They even can delete unwanted software from your cell phone. WTF anyone? No?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDkhzHQO7jY
6:10 to 6:40

evilplaymobils wrote:

i think we kinda missed the point here.

This is usually the last sentence before Godwin's law is triggered. Everyone, take shelter...

Rule 32 on Tux please.


I'm so meta, even this acronym

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#50 2010-06-30 00:00:56

chillicampari
Pinball Wizard
Registered: 2009-10-09
Posts: 2,728

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

2j3iphw.jpg

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