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#51 2015-04-14 05:37:46

smacz
#! Junkie
Registered: 2014-12-09
Posts: 250

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

@johnraff & BL Dev Team,

johnraff wrote:

A "netinstall" install should also be possible, installing a base Debian Jessie system and installing a metapackage from the BL repository that will pull in all the other necessary packages and perform necessary configuration.

Suspending discussion about default applications to keep it straightforward and to-the-point; what happens after the netinstall boots up? Most people stick to Wally as a template towards a workable system in X, but there are certainly a few tweaks to be made. Like making sure the appropriate lua packages are included so that the bl-recent-places pipemenu works, etc. Another good resource is your bunsen-base post. (Whiiiiiich naturally turned into a default apps thread. Oh well.) I know @pvsage has his opinion about reiserfs packages, but they're still in both Wally and bunsen-base. But as you've said time and time again:

Wally isn't ... a pre-release BunsenLabs.

So, is there then to be, and can there be established, a definitive thread/repo/something where a list/discussion of the packages that go on top of the netinstall can be kept up-to-date and also lists if they are to be installed with/without recommends? (despite that it looks like everything will probably end up pulling their recommends in when it gets to a metapackage) Hell, you already have an empty bunsen-installscripts repo and/or an empty bunsen-docs repo to keep an updated list if need be.

Obviously default applications are a tougher subject to tackle, but getting a base system down may be a good starting point. Developers and testers could then have a common base to work off of.

P.S. By application I mean any web-browser, email client, terminal, bittorrent client, media player, pdf viewer, irc client, im client, picture viewer, screensaver, power manager, archive manager, volume mixer, and/or network manager. (Each perhaps deserving of it's own thread.)

P.P.S.I may be jumping ahead of myself to Stage 5. If I am I apologize

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Help fund CrunchBang, donate to the project!

#52 2015-04-14 07:10:49

johnraff
nullglob
From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2009-01-07
Posts: 4,148
Website

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

The apps list is a topic that hasn't yet been exhaustively studied. Some things have been decided, like viewnior>mirage, volti for volume (I think), Gimp in the welcome script...

Most of it will be like CrunchBang - it's what people expect, and what will in fact be needed mostly. Don't get too hung up on that temporary Wally list - that was just an attempt to clone Waldorf. In fact, I doubt if there will be extensive discussions of apps to leave out/add ... a "suggestions for Janice" thread went on for pages and pages... Everyone has their favourites and it's impossible to reach a consensus, so I think it will be safest to stay close to the CrunchBang list. Philip didn't do such a bad job actually. smile

Eventually there will be metapackages to pull it all in.


John
--------------------
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#! forum moderator    BunsenLabs

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#53 2015-04-14 07:26:54

damo
#! gimpbanger
From: N51.5 W002.8 (mostly)
Registered: 2011-11-24
Posts: 5,434

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

..and to add that there has been some discussion about application options in the pipemenus, and a way for users to easily add/remove them without having to edit the menu itself.


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#54 2015-04-14 07:32:44

smacz
#! Junkie
Registered: 2014-12-09
Posts: 250

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

@johnraff I do apologize for the misunderstanding, but I was actually attempting to avoid any discussion whatsoever of default applications with that post, and focus more on system utilities that were not brought in with the base utils in the netinstall. Stuff that in itself not an application, for instance: lua5.2, bzip2, libnotify-bin, or e2fsprogs.

EDIT: I don't believe I emphasized this point enough in the first sentence of the first paragraph of that post:

Suspending discussion about default applications to keep it straightforward and to-the-point...

Last edited by smacz (2015-04-14 07:35:57)

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#55 2015-04-14 08:46:17

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

johnraff wrote:

Sorry, it's the usual "when it's ready". Anyway ASAP.

Okay...understood.

johnraff wrote:

Quite hard I'd say, or at least quite messy. That's why Wally isn't presented as a pre-release BunsenLabs, but as a development tool. It will probably be easier to backup what you want to keep and do a fresh install of BunsenLabs (when it's ready big_smile  ).

Thank you for the info.

johnraff wrote:

I don't think that's going to happen. It would have to be based on Debian Sid, which a number of people here on the forums use and like but requires a certain level of experience to deal with the breakages that occur sometimes. Of course it is possible to upgrade a Debian Jessie system to Sid if you want to.

Not a problem.  I may follow instructions for a net install, using Siduction Xorg as a base.  I want to have another go at running Sid/Unstable on one of my machines under a separate partition.


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#56 2015-04-19 20:08:06

pvsage
Internal Affairs
From: North Carolina
Registered: 2009-10-18
Posts: 13,970

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

Opening post edited to include info about the forum's status and maintenance.  tl;dr: not going anywhere in foreseeable future.

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#57 2015-04-19 20:56:09

phle
Member
From: Sweden
Registered: 2015-02-17
Posts: 21

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

pvsage wrote:

Opening post edited to include info about the forum's status and maintenance.  tl;dr: not going anywhere in foreseeable future.

pvsage wrote:

(EDITED - 19 April 2015:  I have just received confirmation that corenominal, the former developer of CrunchBang and the administrator of this forum, is happy to keep the lights on here indefinitely.  With this in mind, I recommend anyone who wants to contribute to the maintenance of the forum to use the ᴅᴏɴᴀᴛᴇ link in the forum's top menu.)

Very nice - thank you, corenominal!

Also:
... uhm, maybe open the ability to actually donate again, then?
wink  smile


2015-09-30: officially moved over to the BunsenLabs Forums.

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#58 2015-04-19 22:57:17

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

corenominal may have stopped creating #! but he's a champ and helping BunsenLabs like this has to say something about the "person".
And I'd be remiss if I didn't say bobobex you rock as well.  Thank you both!

What a couple!

phle wrote:

Also:
... uhm, maybe open the ability to actually donate again, then?

OOPS! OK corenominal ... your tuen again!  smile

Turn ... I meant turn!!!!  lol  I'm tired and it's showing ...


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#59 2015-04-19 23:44:07

pvsage
Internal Affairs
From: North Carolina
Registered: 2009-10-18
Posts: 13,970

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

Sector11 wrote:

OOPS! OK corenominal ... your tuen again!  smile

YESH!  Moar donaishuns pleez! big_smile

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#60 2015-04-19 23:52:01

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

lol  lol  lol I go schleep now ... me tired.  roll


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#61 2015-04-20 00:16:46

pvsage
Internal Affairs
From: North Carolina
Registered: 2009-10-18
Posts: 13,970

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

^ Just watched a TED talk featuring several LOLcats.  I can haz excuse? lol

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#62 2015-04-20 01:05:24

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

pvsage wrote:

Opening post edited to include info about the forum's status and maintenance.  tl;dr: not going anywhere in foreseeable future.

Thank you, Corenominal and bobobex!

I think it would be a good idea to post the news in the News & Announcements forum.

The domain name and other references to CrunchBang are going to be changed to BunsenLabs though, correct?


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#63 2015-04-20 01:21:14

seraphtrend
#! CrunchBanger
From: Florida
Registered: 2011-12-03
Posts: 100

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

KrunchTime wrote:
pvsage wrote:

Opening post edited to include info about the forum's status and maintenance.  tl;dr: not going anywhere in foreseeable future.

Thank you, Corenominal and bobobex!

I think it would be a good idea to post the news in the News & Announcements forum.

The domain name and other references to CrunchBang are going to be changed to BunsenLabs though, correct?


Probably not because Crunchbang is still downloadable and even though it is out of production it is still a functioning relic. At some point a clean divisive line should be drawn. That is why I believe he asked for the name not to be used in any future releases.

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#64 2015-04-20 01:42:49

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

seraphtrend wrote:

Probably not because Crunchbang is still downloadable and even though it is out of production it is still a functioning relic. At some point a clean divisive line should be drawn. That is why I believe he asked for the name not to be used in any future releases.

I don't think that's a good idea then.  The clean divisive line should come soon IMO, especially when the BunsenLabs Hydrogen release is ready.


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#65 2015-04-20 03:36:27

damo
#! gimpbanger
From: N51.5 W002.8 (mostly)
Registered: 2011-11-24
Posts: 5,434

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

KrunchTime wrote:

......
The domain name and other references to CrunchBang are going to be changed to BunsenLabs though, correct?

A BunsenLabs domain name has been set up already.


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#66 2015-04-20 05:19:51

johnraff
nullglob
From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2009-01-07
Posts: 4,148
Website

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

That's very good news @pvsage and a great relief.

A very very big THANK YOU to Philip, and Becky too, without whose support I'm sure all this wouldn't be continuing.

anmflower.gif


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--------------------
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#! forum moderator    BunsenLabs

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#67 2015-04-20 11:20:10

cpoakes
#! CrunchBanger
From: Tucson, Arizona
Registered: 2012-05-19
Posts: 202

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

KrunchTime wrote:
seraphtrend wrote:

Probably not because Crunchbang is still downloadable and even though it is out of production it is still a functioning relic. At some point a clean divisive line should be drawn. That is why I believe he asked for the name not to be used in any future releases.

I don't think that's a good idea then.  The clean divisive line should come soon IMO, especially when the BunsenLabs Hydrogen release is ready.

CrunchBang waldorf is wheezy.  I would hope CrunchBang remains available as long as wheezy gets security updates.  Assuming a May release for Jessie, wheezy is supported until May 2016. (LTS status undecided).  Just because one can move on does not mean everyone will or even should.


programming and administering unix since 1976 (BSD, System III, Xenix, System V, Linux)

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#68 2015-04-20 13:59:57

Zill
#! CrunchBanger
From: Lincolnshire, UK
Registered: 2009-10-25
Posts: 201

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

cpoakes wrote:

... CrunchBang waldorf is wheezy.  I would hope CrunchBang remains available as long as wheezy gets security updates.  Assuming a May release for Jessie, wheezy is supported until May 2016. (LTS status undecided).  Just because one can move on does not mean everyone will or even should.

+1

I, for one, will be keeping my two Waldorf/Wheezy systems running for as long as possible.  If/when I need some of the new functionality in BunsenLabs/Jessie then I will upgrade.   But until then, if it ain't broke, I won't fix it!

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#69 2015-04-20 18:56:19

seraphtrend
#! CrunchBanger
From: Florida
Registered: 2011-12-03
Posts: 100

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

Zill wrote:
cpoakes wrote:

... CrunchBang waldorf is wheezy.  I would hope CrunchBang remains available as long as wheezy gets security updates.  Assuming a May release for Jessie, wheezy is supported until May 2016. (LTS status undecided).  Just because one can move on does not mean everyone will or even should.

+1

I, for one, will be keeping my two Waldorf/Wheezy systems running for as long as possible.  If/when I need some of the new functionality in BunsenLabs/Jessie then I will upgrade.   But until then, if it ain't broke, I won't fix it!

+1
That's surely what I'm doing. I gotta say though, I'm curious to see what new treats await us in Jessie.

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#70 2015-05-02 10:23:40

photonucleon
Quantum Geek
From: Hogwarts
Registered: 2013-06-10
Posts: 952

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

Can I just say - and apologies if this is kinda cluttering up the thread - development on BunsenLabs is looking GREAT. I'm still in awe of how people here have come together so strongly to keep the spirit of #! going, with surprisingly minimal and constructive argument considering this is the internet... tongue

I'd love to help, but study... exams...  8.(

TL;DR: this is awesome!

I look forward to Hydrogen big_smile


- Ai! Aníron Undómiel. -
- Some things are certain. -
- Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta. -

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#71 2015-05-02 16:35:53

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

@Zill:  I have new equipment.  WiFi currently doesn't work under Debian Wheezy.  Newer equipment plus my enchantment with new shiny stuff means I'd love to upgrade as soon as Hydrogen comes out.  However, Rainlendar currently will not run under Jessie because the Debian devs pulled libjpeg8 back in January.  So, either Rainlendar needs to be upgraded to work with the replacement for libjpeg8, or the package needs to be put back into the Jessie repo.  I'm thinking that libjpeg8 will not return to the Jessie repo though.  I use Rainlendar for my calendar and to-do list needs.


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#72 2015-05-02 16:47:36

Zill
#! CrunchBanger
From: Lincolnshire, UK
Registered: 2009-10-25
Posts: 201

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

KrunchTime:  If your hardware is too new for Wheezy then I agree that this is a good reason to upgrade to Jessie/Hydrogen.

However, problems with Rainlendar are simply indicative of the perils of using proprietary software IMO.  You can hope that they will get it to run on Jessie or look for another (FOSS) application that does run on Jessie. wink

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#73 2015-05-02 17:07:04

Head_on_a_Stick
CatMod
From: A world of pure imagination
Registered: 2014-01-21
Posts: 4,797

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

KrunchTime wrote:

the Debian devs pulled libjpeg8 back in January.

I have backported the Sid version of libjpeg8:
http://s000.tinyupload.com/download.php … 3569976578

You can safely install it in a Jessie system by downloading the .deb & using gdebi or:

sudo dpkg -i libjpeg8_8d1-2\~bpo70+1_amd64.deb

wink

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#74 2015-05-02 20:59:33

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

Three Cheers for HoaS!!!!  KUDOS!


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Be excellent to each other!

#75 2015-05-03 20:59:11

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: BunsenLabs Development Team and current status

@Zill:  There are FOSS alternatives...Osmo comes to mind.  However, I love Rainlendar even if it is proprietary and there is nothing in the FOSS world that comes close to it IMO.  Besides, I think eventually things will be ironed out one way or another.

@HoaS:  Thank you very much for that.  I will plan on using that on my current Wally install as well as on Hydrogen when it is released.

Wine also relies on libjpeg8 and though it works without the package, it doesn't work as well.  I'm suprised that Debian decided to release Jessie with Wine working the way it does.

@Hoas:  You might consider using another file sharing service.  Clicking on the link to download the file opened another window asking me to download something called iLivid.  yikes

Last edited by KrunchTime (2015-05-03 21:05:59)


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