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#326 2014-11-13 17:04:18

pvsage
Internal Affairs
From: North Carolina
Registered: 2009-10-18
Posts: 13,970

Re: boycott systemd

Yes, damo & Unia, you are correct; I did not fully attribute my sources.  Bad mod! :8  Still, I doubt Philip and I are the only ones expressing that sentiment.

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Be excellent to each other!

#327 2014-11-13 17:49:21

Unia
#! Octo-portal-pussy
From: The Netherlands
Registered: 2010-07-17
Posts: 4,634
Website

Re: boycott systemd

Ah yes, I missed that post.  wink


If you can't sit by a cozy fire with your code in hand enjoying its simplicity and clarity, it needs more work. --Carlos Torres

I am a #! forum moderator. Feel free to send me a PM with any question you have!

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#328 2014-11-13 19:08:01

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: boycott systemd

I'm not bored, I am learning though.  I don't know enough to be on one side or the other, I thought I was now I'm in the middle.  I want to use #! Linux, if it comes with systemd so be it.


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#329 2014-11-13 19:19:01

CSCoder4ever
BL Keyboard Troll
From: /dev/zero
Registered: 2013-09-03
Posts: 2,256

Re: boycott systemd

^ Slackware + Openbox.

just ask @Barnabyh about project Slackbang  cool

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#330 2014-11-13 19:31:12

exidux
#! CrunchBanger
From: Your screen.
Registered: 2014-09-05
Posts: 202
Website

Re: boycott systemd

https://corenominal.org/

This proves to me my posts got ignored in here. 8.(

Many pages back i already mentioned corenominal his website where
he posted that statement...  sad


~ When jessie hits stable you could upgrade crunchbang and keep it alive a bit longer.

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#331 2014-11-13 23:47:05

johnraff
nullglob
From: Nagoya, Japan
Registered: 2009-01-07
Posts: 4,148
Website

Re: boycott systemd

Sector11 wrote:

I'm not bored, I am learning though.  I don't know enough to be on one side or the other...

Me too.

I've seen so much "for heaven's sake don't let this destroy Debian" stuff lately though - let's just hope it doesn't. icon_eek.gif


John
--------------------
( a boring Japan blog , Japan Links, idle twitterings  and GitStuff )
#! forum moderator    BunsenLabs

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#332 2014-11-14 06:28:49

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: boycott systemd

^ It's not just Debian that might get destroyed.  I find it hard to believe that a number of Linux distros will allow systemd to become so entwined with everything that a distro cannot exist without it.


Linux User #586672
Come and Die -- Kyle Idleman

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#333 2014-11-14 06:34:07

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: boycott systemd

common-sense wrote:

... systemd has stalled me to. Quite possibly it is a factor for Corenominal too, and it could be one of several factors that explains why there is no Janice release yet?

Why would it be a factor for Corenominal?  CrunchBang is just a slightly customized variant of Debian Stable.
 

CSCoder4ever wrote:

Slackware + Openbox. just ask @Barnabyh about project Slackbang  cool

...or you could just install the Openbox version of Salix.  Salix makes Slackware easier to use and maintain.

Last edited by KrunchTime (2014-11-14 06:37:07)


Linux User #586672
Come and Die -- Kyle Idleman

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#334 2014-11-14 08:04:58

Head_on_a_Stick
CatMod
From: A world of pure imagination
Registered: 2014-01-21
Posts: 4,797

Re: boycott systemd

More awesomeness from @edbarx on the Debian forums; the guy just doesn't stop:
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=118800

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#335 2014-11-14 21:22:32

Alad
Software Satan
Registered: 2014-02-20
Posts: 1,512

Re: boycott systemd

This thread is almost as long as the COTC thread tongue  8o

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#336 2014-11-14 21:24:57

damo
#! gimpbanger
From: N51.5 W002.8 (mostly)
Registered: 2011-11-24
Posts: 5,434

Re: boycott systemd

Alad wrote:

This thread is almost as long as the COTC thread tongue  8o

But that thread is a lot more interesting and useful tongue


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#337 2014-11-14 21:27:11

Alad
Software Satan
Registered: 2014-02-20
Posts: 1,512

Re: boycott systemd

lol  lol  lol

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#338 2014-11-15 07:59:00

vic
#! by Default
From: /grill
Registered: 2009-02-13
Posts: 3,361

Re: boycott systemd

Thanks for putting things into perspective damo.  lol


Time to move on!#

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#339 2014-11-15 15:08:45

common-sense
#! CrunchBanger
Registered: 2014-09-08
Posts: 130

Re: boycott systemd

KrunchTime wrote:
common-sense wrote:

... systemd has stalled me to. Quite possibly it is a factor for Corenominal too, and it could be one of several factors that explains why there is no Janice release yet?

Why would it be a factor for Corenominal?  CrunchBang is just a slightly customized variant of Debian Stable.

Yes, today it is. But if he wanted to go for an alternative solution, it would be quite a bit of work to do it based on Debian Jessie, which will ship with systemd as default. Someone deeply opposed to Systemd would never release anything with it. So then there are a few options. Wait and hope that the wind shifts, or implement an alternative that will complicate everything, and most likely leave the users in a dependency hell at some point. Or of course, he could say "Screw it, we'll use Waldorf as long as it works, and then call it quits".

So for me it boils down to this. If Corenominal is in favour of systemd, then there will be a Janice. If he's against Systemd, then probably not any time soon.... I've seen it before in other distros. Developers waiting for issues to go away by themselves.

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#340 2014-11-16 06:23:57

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: boycott systemd

@common-sense:  There's supposed to be a shim to allow users to use other init systems if desired.  However, I agree that it will probably be a temporary thing.  Eventually, unless as you say the wind shifts, it appears we'll all be using systemd.


Linux User #586672
Come and Die -- Kyle Idleman

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#341 2014-11-16 23:07:26

Head_on_a_Stick
CatMod
From: A world of pure imagination
Registered: 2014-01-21
Posts: 4,797

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#342 2014-11-17 12:49:32

vic
#! by Default
From: /grill
Registered: 2009-02-13
Posts: 3,361

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#343 2014-11-17 19:23:22

twoion
Moderator
Registered: 2012-05-11
Posts: 1,648

Re: boycott systemd


Tannhäuser ~ {www,pkg,ddl}.bunsenlabs.org/{gitlog,repoidx}

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#344 2014-11-18 03:11:44

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: boycott systemd

Wow...they're dropping like flies.  yikes


Linux User #586672
Come and Die -- Kyle Idleman

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#345 2014-11-18 05:20:39

exidux
#! CrunchBanger
From: Your screen.
Registered: 2014-09-05
Posts: 202
Website

Re: boycott systemd

These people do not seem to be leaving because of systemd, but because of the
hate, insults, and attacks directed against them and the init system.

Which (to word it in a friendly manner) the less reasonable anti systemd folk
abuse to go and write giant flames blaming systemd instead of themselves and
their behaviour.


~ When jessie hits stable you could upgrade crunchbang and keep it alive a bit longer.

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#346 2014-11-18 13:01:47

common-sense
#! CrunchBanger
Registered: 2014-09-08
Posts: 130

Re: boycott systemd

KrunchTime wrote:

@common-sense:  There's supposed to be a shim to allow users to use other init systems if desired.  However, I agree that it will probably be a temporary thing.  Eventually, unless as you say the wind shifts, it appears we'll all be using systemd.

Yeah, I agree with you. That's why I'm thinking that it perhaps isn't much point resisting the change. If we are ending up with systemd in the end anyway, then it's probably best to do the transition right away. Instead of taking a temporary alternative route. Using a different init system than whats default in Debian, would complicate things for the developer, and the more unskilled users would end up struggling with it. Not being able to handle the limitations and dependency issues that most certainly will arise.

Last edited by common-sense (2014-11-18 13:02:18)

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#347 2014-11-18 16:30:19

g33zr
#! Die Hard
From: Never Never Land
Registered: 2013-02-19
Posts: 635

Re: boycott systemd

^ I agree because it makes sense to me. I don't understand the sometimes hysterical brouhaha against systemd. From what I've read, it's faster and performs better than the alternatives. But I'm a Linux noob, so what do I know?  8)


It's never too late to learn something new! wink

OHCG | LXer

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#348 2014-11-18 20:11:15

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,264

Re: boycott systemd

@g33zr:  Have you checked out the boycottsystemd site?  If yes, do you still not understand the concerns people have with systemd?  Some of the concerns pointed out are not shrill or drivel, they're valid concerns IMO.


Linux User #586672
Come and Die -- Kyle Idleman

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#349 2014-11-18 21:05:41

g33zr
#! Die Hard
From: Never Never Land
Registered: 2013-02-19
Posts: 635

Re: boycott systemd

@KrunchTime: I think the boycottsystemd site, while perhaps expressing a valid concern or two about freedom, appears to ignore the argument voiced by others elsewhere that systemd functions better and is thus currently the best choice. If that were not the case, then Arch, Debian, et al. wouldn't have chosen it. Linux is, after all, about choice. If the devs of "name that distro" choose systemd over another init alternative, then we as users can accept that or select a another distro. Personally, if it works the way I prefer, that's fine with me.

In short, I view the opposition to systemd as often unnecessarily shrill, similar to discussions about internet "security." But, as I said above, what do I know?  smile


It's never too late to learn something new! wink

OHCG | LXer

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#350 2014-11-18 21:09:40

Head_on_a_Stick
CatMod
From: A world of pure imagination
Registered: 2014-01-21
Posts: 4,797

Re: boycott systemd

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:

I should have explained this better -- this link explains the reasoning behind Debian's choice of systemd as an init system.

It is a superb analysis: I recommend reading it...

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