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#1 2013-03-22 16:50:09

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Yes, I've had that trouble for more than a month now, and on these forums, I've also seen millions of posts and threads asking for help on this. So, finally, I decided to change my behavior and start being the one who "tries" to make a change.
GREAT THANKS goes to WaldoEmerson from this thread for helping me to realize the huge difference between Debian Wheezy and Statler. If he hadn't mentioned looking up the Debian Wheezy wiki, I would've been stuck for the rest of my life.
Now, enough nonsense.

Note: I'm assuming you all know that this will erase ALL data on your USBs.

Step 1: Use any tool to erase all the data on your USB and create a new FAT32 partition. Label it "debian_live" (that probably isn't necessary, but that's what I named it, and that is also the default name of the Debian ISO's). I used GParted.

Step 2: Mount the USB partition (usually not necessary, most distros automatically mount the USB when you unplug it and plug it back in) and startup UNetbootin.

$ sudo unetbootin

If you don't have UNetbootin, you can install it from apt.

$ sudo apt-get install unetbootin

Step 3: Use UNetbootin to copy the latest Waldorf ISO to the USB. Both PAE and non-PAE should be fine. Navigate to and select the Waldorf ISO and select /dev/sdX1 as the target drive.

Step 4: Eject the USB and boot a computer from CrunchBang to make sure nothing's gone wrong so far. Note that at the moment there is NO persistence yet, so there is none to worry (unless it refuses to boot).

Step 5: Put the USB back into a Linux system (not the LiveUSB system) and use your favorite partitioning tool to resize the first partition and make a new partition labeled "persistence" (not "live-rw"). Also, be sure that the format is in a Linux file format (any ext format). Again, I used GParted.


Step 6: Make a new file in the persistence partition labeled "live-persistence.conf," and add only one line to the file:

/ union

Step 7: Modify the syslinux.cfg in the main partition (/dev/sdb1) and add "persistence" (NOT "persistent") after "boot=live" in the first two entries: Default and Live Session.

label unetbootindefault
menu label Default
kernel /ubnkern
append initrd=/ubninit boot=live persistence config quiet

label ubnentry0
menu label Live Session
kernel /live/vmlinuz
append initrd=/live/initrd.img boot=live persistence config quiet

Step 8: Boot into your live USB and enjoy persistence! smile

Feel free to ask me about any problems you encounter or make suggestions, but I might not be able to help you with all of them!

Note: Persistence in this case does NOT appear on the "persistence" partition; instead, it actually appears as part of the root partition. Therefore, try making a file in your "home" folder, restart, and check to see if it remains.

Known Issue:
When in the file manager, the "persistence" USB partition is listed on the navigation bar. However, it cannot be mounted for whatever reason I do not know. That's not a huge problem though (unless you have OCD), as persistence should still work mostly fine.

One way that *might* fix this is to, in live-persistence.conf, in place of "/ union," write

/etc
/live
/home
/media
/tmp
/usr
/var

However, I cannot guarantee this works, and many might say this is inconcise and probably inefficient. Again, please point out my shortcomings as I am relatively new to Linux, and I will gladly change this guide.

Thanks for reading and commenting with suggestions/words of gratitude!

References:
Debian Live Manual
Also many Debian forums that told me that the configuration file should be named "live-persistence.conf" instead of "persistence.conf"

Hope I helped all!
Kye

Last edited by kyeshi98 (2013-04-28 12:00:39)

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#2 2013-03-22 17:25:52

Barnabyh
#! Die Hard
From: Church of the Subgenius
Registered: 2012-11-07
Posts: 798
Website

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Nice one, at the very least I can say thank you. Will keep this in mind for the future.


From ArchBang to SlackBang | Project SlackBang

Say no to bugs. - It's not a bug, it's a worm.

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#3 2013-03-23 07:13:50

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Barnabyh wrote:

Nice one, at the very least I can say thank you. Will keep this in mind for the future.

smile My pleasure to help. Feel free to leave any suggestions or anything. smile

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#4 2013-03-24 05:24:49

notroot
New Member
Registered: 2013-03-22
Posts: 3

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

There's lots of guides on how to do this with Statler, but this might be a first for Waldorf.  Thanks and congrats!

It should be possible to do the same thing using a container file, like with live-rw.  I followed your guidelines, only instead of partitioning, I tried following these instructions on how to make a live-rw file, but instead naming it "persistence".  That didn't work.  I tried it with live-persistence.conf both outside and inside of the "persistence" file.  Then I found this page which says you can do it, only to name the file "live.persist".  So I renamed it and it still didn't work.  I didn't read that page very closely though so maybe someone smarter than me can try it.  It could be you have to name the file "live.persist" when you make it, not rename it later.  Or else there is some other minor thing you have to do differently.    But surely it can be done.

EDIT: okay I read the section of the Debian Manual you linked and it says you can indeed use a file, named "persistence".    It goes into how to mount it and create the live-persistence.conf inside it.  It says "persistence.conf" but you are probably correct that it should be "live-persistence.conf".  (I don't know what that other page I found is all about.)  So this should work.

Last edited by notroot (2013-03-24 06:50:43)

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#5 2013-03-24 07:14:04

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

notroot wrote:

There's lots of guides on how to do this with Statler, but this might be a first for Waldorf.  Thanks and congrats!

It should be possible to do the same thing using a container file, like with live-rw.  I followed your guidelines, only instead of partitioning, I tried following these instructions on how to make a live-rw file, but instead naming it "persistence".  That didn't work.  I tried it with live-persistence.conf both outside and inside of the "persistence" file.  Then I found this page which says you can do it, only to name the file "live.persist".  So I renamed it and it still didn't work.  I didn't read that page very closely though so maybe someone smarter than me can try it.  It could be you have to name the file "live.persist" when you make it, not rename it later.  Or else there is some other minor thing you have to do differently.    But surely it can be done.

EDIT: okay I read the section of the Debian Manual you linked and it says you can indeed use a file, named "persistence".    It goes into how to mount it and create the live-persistence.conf inside it.  It says "persistence.conf" but you are probably correct that it should be "live-persistence.conf".  (I don't know what that other page I found is all about.)  So this should work.

^ Thanks to you for reading smile
As for why I didn't do a tutorial on a file but instead a partition, it was actually because that was what I was always trying to do AND because I wanted to be able to edit my files externally and easily. However, if you prefer to use a file, I'll look that up and see if I can be able to make a small guide on that too smile

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#6 2013-03-24 19:55:03

notroot
New Member
Registered: 2013-03-22
Posts: 3

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Hey that would be great!  The advantage of a file is you can back it up easily just by copying it and always get your system back the way it was when you made the copy.  I do that right before installing new packages I'm not familiar with.   Then you can compress the backups so they don't take up a lot of space.   You can always mount the persistence file from another OS to get at your stuff that way if necessary.

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#7 2013-03-25 11:46:23

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

notroot wrote:

Hey that would be great!  The advantage of a file is you can back it up easily just by copying it and always get your system back the way it was when you made the copy.  I do that right before installing new packages I'm not familiar with.   Then you can compress the backups so they don't take up a lot of space.   You can always mount the persistence file from another OS to get at your stuff that way if necessary.

That makes sense. I just preferred the OS usable as a USB disk anytime. Also, there was the 4GB file size limit of FAT32 filesystems to keep in mind.

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#8 2013-04-25 18:01:50

mising
New Member
Registered: 2013-04-25
Posts: 1

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

A question in regards to:
Note: Persistence in this case does NOT appear on the "persistence" partition; instead, it actually appears as part of the root partition. Therefore, try making a file in your "home" folder, restart, and check to see if it remains.
and
Step 5: Put the USB back into a Linux system (not the LiveUSB system) and use your favorite partitioning tool to resize the first partition and make a new partition labeled "persistence" (not "live-rw"). Again, I used GParted.

Does the persistence partition need to be just big enough for the  conf file, since the persistence is not stored there? 
The way I understand from your post is that the persistence is stored on the root partition, so if my first partition is just big enough for the live image, then it won't have any room to store the persistent files.
Am I misinterpreting something?
Also in Step 6, is there supposed to be a space between the / and union?
Thank you

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#9 2013-04-26 15:39:25

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

mising wrote:

A question in regards to:
Note: Persistence in this case does NOT appear on the "persistence" partition; instead, it actually appears as part of the root partition. Therefore, try making a file in your "home" folder, restart, and check to see if it remains.
and
Step 5: Put the USB back into a Linux system (not the LiveUSB system) and use your favorite partitioning tool to resize the first partition and make a new partition labeled "persistence" (not "live-rw"). Again, I used GParted.

Does the persistence partition need to be just big enough for the  conf file, since the persistence is not stored there? 
The way I understand from your post is that the persistence is stored on the root partition, so if my first partition is just big enough for the live image, then it won't have any room to store the persistent files.
Am I misinterpreting something?
Also in Step 6, is there supposed to be a space between the / and union?
Thank you

Oh, hey. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough. Persistence IS stored in the "persistence" partition. It is just that when CrunchBang Live starts up, it kinda messes up with the mounting of the "persistence" partition, so the "persistence" partition displayed on the left bar as one of the mounted drives - that one is not the actual persistence drive. In simpler words, I'm saying that the partition that Waldorf tells you is the "persistence" partition is not the actual "persistence" partition and will only give an error when you try to mount it, UNLIKE STATLER, where the "live-rw" partition displayed is the actual "live-rw" partition. Sorry if I'm not clear enough!

Therefore, to sum it up, persistence is stored in the "persistence" partition although when you boot up from the LiveUSB, Waldorf makes EVERYTHING look as if it's stored on the root partition (even the live-persistence.conf). All I'm telling you is to not worry when you get an error when you try to check out the contents of "persistence" from the left sidebar.

Lastly, yes. There is a space between "/" and "union."

Thanks,
Kye

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#10 2013-04-28 00:28:34

jeepee
New Member
From: Plano, Tx
Registered: 2011-06-24
Posts: 4

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Hi, thank you for this guide, I wanted to say it helped a lot and I'm writing this from a live boot of Waldorf right now thanks to it smile

I did want to add one thing though to step 5, which is that the second partition, "persistence", needs to be a Linux filesystem specifcally.  I guess it might be obvious once you think about it, but since the first partition was a Fat32, I assumed the second would need to be too.  After some TSing where every boot with persistence resulted the system looping repeatedly with an error that was too fast for me to catch, I found in one of your links an fdisk output that showed the second partition's info.

I deleted the second partition and created an ext2 one in it's place (I swear I choose ext3, but guess not) and now I can boot up without issue.  I hope that can save other's a little time wink

Thanks again for the guide!

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#11 2013-04-28 11:59:41

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

jeepee wrote:

Hi, thank you for this guide, I wanted to say it helped a lot and I'm writing this from a live boot of Waldorf right now thanks to it smile

I did want to add one thing though to step 5, which is that the second partition, "persistence", needs to be a Linux filesystem specifcally.  I guess it might be obvious once you think about it, but since the first partition was a Fat32, I assumed the second would need to be too.  After some TSing where every boot with persistence resulted the system looping repeatedly with an error that was too fast for me to catch, I found in one of your links an fdisk output that showed the second partition's info.

I deleted the second partition and created an ext2 one in it's place (I swear I choose ext3, but guess not) and now I can boot up without issue.  I hope that can save other's a little time wink

Thanks again for the guide!

Oh, heh. You're welcome, and sorry for leaving the ext2 format out of the guide. Sorry, I was doing a lot of research and by default, I was so used to these guides that I thought that you would've went by the other guides that told you to use ext2. Thanks for pointing that out, and I will add that in!

Thanks
Kye

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#12 2013-07-01 15:32:58

Digit
#! Die Hard
From: the internet
Registered: 2009-05-26
Posts: 1,015
Website

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

awesome lil tute there.

anyone care to extend that to include how to have your persistent storage encrypted too?


~ think ~

without a shot fired
quote of the mo: ""... i realised it's simpler to make a statue to someone who you believe embodies all your better qualities, than it is to actually improve yourself" ... "so i have decided to go away. i will return when i have found a way to destroy this, while keeping the message intact"  -G'Kar

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#13 2013-08-08 15:45:53

provaprova
Member
Registered: 2013-08-08
Posts: 10

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Thanks for the guide, I'd like to know if it's possible to mount the FAT32 partition (not the persistence partition, after all I already have access to it from within the OS). As it's so handy to use it as a storage drive with Windows and then use the USB key to boot a persistent CrunchBang session, I'd like to access those Windows files from within the OS: is this possible?

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#14 2013-09-10 08:16:04

fatmac
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2012-11-14
Posts: 1,948

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

@provaprova - I've only just come across your post.

I don't think it will be possible to access anything on the pendrive directly from Windows.

When it runs, you are actually in a Linux file system, & the persistence is joined to it using the union file system, that is why it appears to all be under the same /.

If you installed a Linux compatible file system access program under Windows, you probably can mount the persistence partition to get at your files.

Last edited by fatmac (2013-09-10 08:19:02)


Linux since 1999
Currently:  AntiX, & Crunchbang.
A good general beginners book for Linux :- http://rute.2038bug.com/index.html.gz
A good Debian read :- http://debian-handbook.info/get/now/

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#15 2013-09-11 09:26:22

provaprova
Member
Registered: 2013-08-08
Posts: 10

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

fatmac: thanks for your reply, actually my problem is the opposite one. I can access the USB drive from Windows, but that partition which Windows accesses (the main fixed bootable OS partition, not the persistence one) I can not access from the persistent live session itself.

It sounds complicated so I'll just post you the gparted screenshot taken directly from the live session:

RiQCQDs.png

since the first partition is FAT32 Windows sees it! What I've done is I've created a folder in the first partition from Windows called Data, in which I put all my stuff. It doesn't interfere with the OS of course. So I'd like to access that from the persistent live session.

Btw I was planning to make a new attempt from scratch in which I just add an extra FAT32 partition as the first one (so that Windows loads it) that also has GRUB installed, and then 2 other partitions, one with crunchbang and the other with persistence. It's more complicated but it's the only solution I've thought of (I'm kind of lazy to try it though).

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#16 2013-09-11 15:41:03

Slowki
New Member
Registered: 2013-09-11
Posts: 2

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

For some reason the persistence isn't working even though I followed the exact steps in this guide, here's my setup:
Oh noes, it nawt workin'
--1080p but it might not show up high rez on the forum, copy image location and paste into browser, if need be. monkey
I just downloaded it today and installed it on the stick using unetbootin's select iso feature. The boot log makes no mention of trying to mount /dev/sdb2 just /dev/sdb, did I screw something up?

Edit:
To an extent I figured out the issue, just putting / union seems to have no effect compared to other settings.

Last edited by Slowki (2013-09-21 06:12:58)

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#17 2013-09-16 21:23:55

maurizio
New Member
Registered: 2013-09-16
Posts: 6

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Kyeshi,
after more than 10 days spent searching in the forums
I could do it thanks to your  howto!
I suppose there is big confusion around about the difference between wheezy and squeeze,
So this confusion I also had.
For Waldorf it's needed to label the partition "persistence".
Also the name of the file I suppose has to be "live-persistence.com".
At least it worked for me also.
I can also confirm that the live system cannot mount the partition and also gives some error message at boot,
But then everything works allright.
Thanks!

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#18 2013-09-23 04:24:45

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

maurizio wrote:

Kyeshi,
after more than 10 days spent searching in the forums
I could do it thanks to your  howto!
I suppose there is big confusion around about the difference between wheezy and squeeze,
So this confusion I also had.
For Waldorf it's needed to label the partition "persistence".
Also the name of the file I suppose has to be "live-persistence.com".
At least it worked for me also.
I can also confirm that the live system cannot mount the partition and also gives some error message at boot,
But then everything works allright.
Thanks!

Welcome, glad I could help. smile
(Yeah, I struggled with it for so long I thought I'd write some help on how to do it so others don't have to freak out like I did) wink

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#19 2013-10-13 13:34:44

Inodoro Pereyra
#! Junkie
From: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Registered: 2013-07-01
Posts: 265

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Ok, I'm following your tutorial to install puppy linux on a USB flash drive. Everything goes great, until I get to step 5, then:

Screenshot_10132013_10_29_12_AM.jpg

What am I doing wrong? sad

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#20 2013-10-13 14:13:59

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Inodoro Pereyra wrote:

Ok, I'm following your tutorial to install puppy linux on a USB flash drive. Everything goes great, until I get to step 5, then:

http://s20.postimg.org/vhf1i1lyx/Screenshot_10132013_10_29_12_AM.jpg

What am I doing wrong? sad

I'm not sure this will work with Puppy Linux. However, may I ask - what flavor of Puppy are you using?

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#21 2013-10-13 14:30:43

Inodoro Pereyra
#! Junkie
From: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Registered: 2013-07-01
Posts: 265

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

kyeshi98 wrote:

However, may I ask - what flavor of Puppy are you using?

Hmmm... I don't have a clue... the one that comes linked in Unetbootin. Didn't know there was more than one flavor... ops

Either way, I triederasing all the data and making the partitions before installing, and it still doesn't work. sad

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#22 2013-10-13 14:38:40

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Oh. Perhaps, try choosing a specific flavor from the official website - as the different flavors are based off of different systems (Slackware, Ubuntu, not sure about Debian) while #! is based directly off of Debian. Therefore, the installation of persistent LiveUSB systems may also vary.

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#23 2013-10-13 16:08:50

Inodoro Pereyra
#! Junkie
From: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Registered: 2013-07-01
Posts: 265

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Thank you kyeshi98.
I'll try with CB first, see if it runs properly on 508 MB of RAM. If it doesn't, I'll go with Puppy. smile

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#24 2013-10-13 16:50:45

kyeshi98
Member
Registered: 2013-02-11
Posts: 35

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Inodoro Pereyra wrote:

Thank you kyeshi98.
I'll try with CB first, see if it runs properly on 508 MB of RAM. If it doesn't, I'll go with Puppy. smile

Sure. However, my experiences tell me that although #! seems like a very lightweight and fast system, Xfce distros seem smoother in performance than #!. Linux Mint Xfce is also something you could try if #! feels a bit laggy (the mouse may visibly lag across the screen). Good luck!

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#25 2013-10-13 16:54:50

Inodoro Pereyra
#! Junkie
From: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Registered: 2013-07-01
Posts: 265

Re: The Correct Way for Persistence on a LiveUSB for WALDORF

Will keep it in mind. Thank you! big_smile

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