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#1 2010-06-27 21:31:02

luvva_cuppa
#! CrunchBanger
Registered: 2009-09-06
Posts: 214

On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

http://thenextweb.com/us/2010/03/08/afr … ear-giant/
Time to rein in another potential beast before it's too late?


"In spite of the cost of living, it's still popular."
Kathleen Norris

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#2 2010-06-27 21:51:24

omns
#! wanderer
From: ~/
Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 5,131

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

I think this is pretty simple. If you don't like it. Don't use it.

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#3 2010-06-27 23:49:56

corenominal
WRONG
From: Lincoln, UK
Registered: 2008-11-20
Posts: 5,131
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

omns wrote:

I think this is pretty simple. If you don't like it. Don't use it.

+1 smile


Ex-developer of #! CrunchBang. Follow me on Twitter smile

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#4 2010-06-28 00:21:25

Awebb
The Singularity
Registered: 2009-07-23
Posts: 2,812

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

I have to watch a video to partake in a discussion that is doomed to lead nowhere by two comments that proof that posting a video without commenting it leads to topics that are doomed to lead nowhere?

I vote for google. One day they will gain controll over the world, so the governmental lying will cease. Google is frank enough to show us that we are beeing spied on and that we are worthles consuments with no real rights. There is no national pride where google reigns. Google will protect us from thoughts we might have and will lead us to joy and tranquility. Google will take a blue pill and shove it right up your rabbit hole.

Dear world.

Thanks for not listening to SciFi authors for more than a century. They all thought it's soooo cool that fiction becomes reality, that they forgot about the fact that fiction usually contains a lot of violence, copulation and bad manners. Now we live under the all seeing eye of a fist full of megacorps, instead of killing a dragon an marry a princess once in a while.

No matter how hard I push, my fiction won't turn into reality, it'll simply go into my pants, that's all. I'm so lucky that I can tell my kids one day (if the agency allows me to have some by then) about how we had our own thoughts in our own brains, wich never got interrupted by commercials. It won't be in their minds for a long time, since Google can delete unwanted thoughts out of brains of any consumern on the planet, no matter what they bought.

Alex

Basically I don't care. If someone upps a pic of me at... say... facebook and so on, I'll find him (since he uses facebook and so on) and slap him around for a while with a large trout. And then I'll paint the walls with the rainbows that his imaginary ponies pooped.

I don't need to watch a video about google. I read 1984 when there was still paper. And now I use Archie to find me some adult material...


I'm so meta, even this acronym

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#5 2010-06-28 00:21:51

jollysnowman
#! CrunchBanger
From: Austin, TX
Registered: 2009-11-17
Posts: 223

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Foreal. They can't gather information you don't provide.

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#6 2010-06-28 01:33:01

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Google?  Why just Google?  Why not something even bigger?

The Internet?

100 years from now I will not care!

Other than that I will deal with things on a day to day basis.


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#7 2010-06-28 04:04:19

safetycopy
urban legend
From: The Chatsubo
Registered: 2010-04-03
Posts: 1,311

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Google is no different than a thousand other companies. Social Security, NHS, your Kroger card, your Block Buster card, your GameFly history, your banking and money habits, blah, blah, blah. It's the world we live in. Sure, people track what you do and where you go, but that's the way it's always been in one form or another. Just be sensible online and don't put any info up you don't want people to have. You can't avoid spam, and you can't not leave traces that companies use to build profiles of you now any more than you could twenty years ago. The method is different these days, but it's the same old thing. Big Brother has always been watching you. It always seems weird to me that people expect to be able to treat the internet like a survivalist treats his basement full of tinned beans and bottled water. It's just not the world we live and hasn't been since the industrial revolution.


i wonder if i missed the warning
Skinny Puppy, Love in Vein

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#8 2010-06-28 10:45:39

pablokal
#! CrunchBanger
From: Nijmegen, Holland
Registered: 2009-12-11
Posts: 232
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

I think that it is disappointing how indifferent the reactions on this forum are when someone tries to raise our consciousness about some serious issues.
Sticking your head in the sand, won't make things go away; well at least most of the time.

The solution "if you don't like it, don't use it", suggests that it is dead simple to not use it.
In fact you can't not use Google when you use this forum; it is supported by google ads; you can't search it without using google.
In fact we're supporting Google by using this forum if we like it or not.
Google earns the most on it and Philip also gets a grain of the profit.
So giving the issue back by saying: :"well , just don't use it, is another way of saying, don't bother me with this issue; I like my arrangement with Google and don't want to make it an issue of debate." +1 and a smile doesn't make clear to me if you even have thought about reconsidering your ties with Google.
It is not that I immediately expect you to do that, but we are all bought and sold here and we let ourselves in with something, blinded by all those free services, that we not really want to look into the way we maybe corrupted our most important interests.
Another example: If you have set up a site on blogger, it is quite a hassle to move it.
When I started there I didn't even know it was owned by Google and maybe it wasn't back then.

Some suggestions:
I finally found a reallygood alternative for google search engine: duckduckgo.
Search add ons for firefox here: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefo … go&cat=all

It has very nice keyboard shortcuts:

    * ↑ ↓
    * Enter (go)
    * j k (arrow alternatives)
    * / (search box)


How to delete your Google account:
Considering how pervasive Google is in our digital existence, you’d think deleting your Google account might be incredibly complicated. After all, many of us use dozens of Google services, and you’d think each one would require separate deletion.

For the most part, deleting your entire Google account is easy. There are only a few services that require special consideration. Of course, with the exception of a couple of services, there’s no way to delete individual services completely from your Google account. For example, with Analytics, you can delete each individual site you’re tracking, but not the Analytics account itself.

To delete your main Google account, login through the Google Accounts homepage. Then click on “Edit” next to “My Products”. From that page, you can delete certain services (Orkut and Web History), as well as delete your entire account by clicking on “Clear account and delete all services and info associated with it”. This will take you to a form where you’ll need to confirm each of the services you’ll be deleting. If you linked your Google account to an existing YouTube account, you’ll need to delete that account separately.

Then you’ll need to confirm your password, and check that you do, indeed, want to close your account, and that you know you’re still responsible for any pending financial transactions associated with your account. Then confirm, and your account will be deleted.

Certain services, including Google Alerts, Groups, and Docs, aren’t automatically deleted in this way. To unsubscribe from alerts, you’ll need to refer back to your original Alerts email (or from any Alerts email you’ve since received) and click the ‘unsubscribe’-link there. For Groups, you’ll also need to unsubscribe from each group.

Google Docs leaves shared documents and presentations available to collaborators and viewers. Spreadsheets, on the other hand, aren’t available to collaborators or viewers once you’ve deleted your account (so have a collaborator create a copy of the spreadsheet prior to deleting your account). With shared documents and presentations, you’ll want to reassign ownership to another user before deleting your account.

Full details on deleting your Google account can be found on the Google’s Help page “Deleting: Your Google Account”> http://www.google.com/support/accounts/ … swer=32046

Last edited by pablokal (2010-06-28 11:42:45)


GNu/Linux: Nu nog schoner: http://linuxnogschoner.blogspot.com/  Dutch

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#9 2010-06-28 10:50:45

benj1
Wiki Wizard
From: Yorkshire, England
Registered: 2009-09-05
Posts: 1,084

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

omns wrote:

I think this is pretty simple. If you don't like it. Don't use it.

whats the alternative? except bing or the soon to be bing powered yahoo.

anyway i think the op has a legitimate concern, although im satisfied that for the moment, the company has some scruples left, it does have its finger in a lot of pies, and eventually advertising is going to stop being the cash cow that it is right now and they're going to have to start looking for other revenue/cost savings.


- - - - - - - - Wiki Pages - - - - - - -
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configuring Conky       *installing scripts

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#10 2010-06-28 11:12:14

pablokal
#! CrunchBanger
From: Nijmegen, Holland
Registered: 2009-12-11
Posts: 232
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

whats the alternative?

I finally found a reallygood alternative for google search engine: duckduckgo: http://duckduckgo.com/about.html
Search add ons for firefox here: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefo … go&cat=all


GNu/Linux: Nu nog schoner: http://linuxnogschoner.blogspot.com/  Dutch

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#11 2010-06-28 12:12:51

achristoffersen
#! Junkie
Registered: 2009-03-23
Posts: 354

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

scroogle is another way to lessen the google paranoia. It lets you search through google - but anonymously.

The problem here is: I want the companies to know me. I want them to suggest serch-terms, products, upcoming events and even possible friends, based on my behaviour.

On the other hand - I don't want them to abuse that information. To tell me wife if I am cheating, to inform the insurance company that my insurance premium should go up,  because I use linux - and hence is an outlier in terms of behaviour (but would I like my insurance premium to go down because my google searches suggest that I always buy products based on saftytest, and besides have a knack of fixing them my self???).  And even though the system has no interest in whether I use porn or not, an employee in that system might have that interest. There are lots of examples where employees privy to confidential information has used it for personal gains, vendattas or pure fun. I know - because I have worked with confidential information.

The problem is real. And it's a balance.

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#12 2010-06-28 12:51:56

semko
#! Member
From: Bosnia and Herzegovina
Registered: 2008-12-04
Posts: 97

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

I know that (not only) google knows something about me. So what?
The question is: Is there something I have to hide?
a bit off-topic:
I'm only afraid of those who don't (want to) know.


Truth is on the side of the oppressed.
registered linux user #470990 - Which OS Are You?

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#13 2010-06-28 13:02:29

jollysnowman
#! CrunchBanger
From: Austin, TX
Registered: 2009-11-17
Posts: 223

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

I don't think going through the trouble of find an alternative search engine and deleting your (if it exists) Google account are really necessary to avoid giving away personal information. The only places my full name appears on the internet are on my Facebook, my school personal profile webpage, and various websites that mention me. All of my emails have my last name as an initial, and any important communication is done through my university email (which is essentially an ISP email). I use Thunderbird to access Gmail and as such, I'm pretty much never logged in to my Google account in a browser. Sure, they could look at the IP address and connect the dots if they wanted to, but I don't directly provide any information. Google probably still scans my email for keywords, but I use my Gmail for impersonal things, like store mailing lists, forum registration, and other similar things. And when I do things online like pay bills, I use a private window in Opera to isolate any cookies.

If you minimize your identifying activity, there isn't much to worry about.

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#14 2010-06-28 13:40:18

luvva_cuppa
#! CrunchBanger
Registered: 2009-09-06
Posts: 214

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

@pablokal Thanks for the duckgogo link. I will be exploring it in more detail.
@Awebb continue with your reading of 1984.

Nice tips from forum members on how they maintain their online privacy. Always an interesting read.

I posted the link to the video because I think that the video raises some valid isssues. I am a fan of Google and use some of their services (Gmail, Calendar) but at the same time, to use the pet analogy, if you own a large dog you need to keep it under control otherwise it could get nasty and turn on you. It's just not healthy for any one company to get that big without some system of checks and balances in place.
Worth bearing in mind as the beast is allowed to grow.


"In spite of the cost of living, it's still popular."
Kathleen Norris

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#15 2010-06-28 13:55:54

corenominal
WRONG
From: Lincoln, UK
Registered: 2008-11-20
Posts: 5,131
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

pablokal wrote:

I think that it is disappointing how indifferent the reactions on this forum are when someone tries to raise our consciousness about some serious issues.
Sticking your head in the sand, won't make things go away; well at least most of the time.

I am sorry if I gave you the impression that I am sticking my "head in the sand", this was not my intention. Maybe what I should of said was, "FUD Alert!" big_smile

Seriously, I am as concerned as the next person about some of the issues mentioned in the video, however, the video itself, whilst nicely directed and produced, has absolutely no balance.

The solution "if you don't like it, don't use it", suggests that it is dead simple to not use it.
In fact you can't not use Google when you use this forum; it is supported by google ads; you can't search it without using google.
In fact we're supporting Google by using this forum if we like it or not.

Not true. Yes, I have employed Google services for this site, but it is a fairly trivial matter for anyone to disable them if they wish. Adblock will remove the Google adverts and I am sure there are a number of other different ways too. Regarding searching the forums, why not just use the internal forum search feature?

Google earns the most on it and Philip also gets a grain of the profit.
So giving the issue back by saying: :"well , just don't use it, is another way of saying, don't bother me with this issue; I like my arrangement with Google and don't want to make it an issue of debate." +1 and a smile doesn't make clear to me if you even have thought about reconsidering your ties with Google.

I am happy with the Google services I use. IMHO, they provide the best search service and their Google Adsense service helps to fund this project.

I am aware that some people may have issues with Google, but I am not one of them. smile


Ex-developer of #! CrunchBang. Follow me on Twitter smile

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#16 2010-06-28 14:16:14

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

My first response was somewhat slap hazard.  Why not the Internet.  But in some respects the "Net" is the problem.  Google is doing what all companies want to do, expand and grow.  Take a look at Microsoft among many others.

I was responding to the title of  the thread:  On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Is Google "sinsiter"?  and "Am I afraid of it?" I do not think so and no!

I do not consider Google sinister. I also do not like their "Privacy Policy".  I do my best not to leave important stuff out there that they might grab onto.  Live my life with nothing to hide and I have nothing to fear.  And even that is a very optimistic outlook and not 100% true.

I read something recently that shook me a bit, can not find the exact statement but it went like this:  Why is it Piracy if I do to them what they do to me in the name of Marketing?

If you believe there is some truth in books (Tom Clancy) and movies then you also think that the US Government is scanning "every" email in the world for "key words" and have you more under thumb than Google ever will.

Where does it stop?

Yes there are other search engines:
- StartPage is a nice one.
- Scroogle was mentioned, but that is still Google and if you believe what Google says, use that as well.  But if you believe Google is "sinister" then why believe what they say Scroogle is?
- Yahoo - bing powered = Microsoft. {sigh}
- and there is the one mentioned above: duckduckgo among many others.

I doubt you will get rid of Google as noted in another post, just using the net connects you.  They are a part of being in the "Net" and the only way to get rid of them entirely:

Do not use the Internet (Your cellphones, PDA's as well)
Microsoft Net collects information of you
AOL collects information on you
Or your little GPS gadget in your car.

As someone said:  This is the world we live in, think about what it was like 50 years ago ... now try to imagine 50 years from now.

It's a vicious circle - I think I'll get off that part and just live as best I can.


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#17 2010-06-28 15:04:51

dove
#! CrunchBanger
Registered: 2009-07-28
Posts: 166

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Oil co.s and our addiction to their product s far more of a issue than "google" for humanities upcoming early extinction.

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#18 2010-06-28 15:24:34

pvsage
Internal Affairs
From: North Carolina
Registered: 2009-10-18
Posts: 13,970

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

My 2¢:

The video ends with "Trying very hard not to be evil" and an approximation of the mask that represents Anakin Skywalker's transformation into Darth Vader.  This is a faulty analogy, unless they're suggesting that some outside force (perhaps another corporate entity) is corrupting Google in the way that Emperor Palpatine/Darth Sidious turned Anakin toward the Dark Side.  So are they suggesting that there is a Bigger Bad pulling Google's strings?

If I took that "report" seriously in any way, I'd want to know more about the people who made it and who provided "promotional consideration" for it.  If, for example, they received funding from Microsoft/Bing!, I would simply consider it an advertisement.

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#19 2010-06-28 15:41:10

Tunafish
#! Die Hard
From: the Netherlands
Registered: 2010-03-07
Posts: 1,204

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Companies like microsoft/google/facebook are trying to make the internet a commercial place. Their only interest is making money and more money. What they do has nothing to do with a free open internet, where people can exchange information. These companies don't care about privacy.  I don't want google (or any other company) to collect all my search strings. Facebook showed/shows us what can be done with all the information you provide.

I use opensource not only for technical reasons. I also use it because i don't like microsofts monopoly (no consumer computers are sold without Windows). And what worries me most about Google: it tries to create a new closed (not opensource i mean) standard for documents with it cloud software (or whatever it's called). 

My privacy extras:
ixquick or duckduckgo search engine
addons: googlesharing, adblock, betterprivacy, cookiesafe, phzilla
pgp/gnupg for email (i like to put my letters in an envelope, so the postman can't read it)

Oil co.s and our addiction to their product s far more of a issue than "google" for humanities upcoming early extinction.

Interesting fact: BP has spend about $ 50 million to protect their imago. They paid a lot of money to become the first (paid) search results on google & bing when searching for 'oil spill' and similar searches.


sed 's/stress/relaxation/g'
Privacy & Security on #!

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#20 2010-06-28 17:42:51

winotree
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 548

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

I reckon if you lived your life as if you had nothing to hide then maybe there'd be nothing to know.

On a more sinister note I remember a woman-friend that, at the time I thought took an inordinate interest in me -- and of course I was flattered.  Turns out within the year she'd used things I'd said, things I'd shared against me.  You don't mean to suggest that Google or our own government would do this, too?  yikes  tongue  lol

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#21 2010-06-28 18:23:41

jollysnowman
#! CrunchBanger
From: Austin, TX
Registered: 2009-11-17
Posts: 223

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

winotree wrote:

I reckon if you lived your life as if you had nothing to hide then maybe there'd be nothing to know.

I don't really think that statement applies to one's Internet activity. cool

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#22 2010-06-28 18:27:14

winotree
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 548

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Sounds good, though.  wink

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#23 2010-06-28 18:48:46

winotree
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2010-03-26
Posts: 548

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

Look here http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=53046 they're talking about it over at Debian Forums, too.

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#24 2010-06-28 19:48:34

Sector11
#!'er to BL'er
From: SR11 Cockpit
Registered: 2010-05-05
Posts: 15,667
Website

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

winotree wrote:

I reckon if you lived your life as if you had nothing to hide then maybe there'd be nothing to know.

On a more sinister note I remember a woman-friend that, at the time I thought took an inordinate interest in me -- and of course I was flattered.  Turns out within the year she'd used things I'd said, things I'd shared against me.  You don't mean to suggest that Google or our own government would do this, too?  yikes  tongue  lol

Damn!  The more you speak the more I think you are telling my life story. If you are going to talk about me. LIE!  Say nice things.  big_smile

I do not have a government!  I have exercised my freedom to not vote, simply because I can never seem to pick the lesser of two evils and vote for the most evil.  Therefore there was only one option open to me - do note vote!  roll

Last edited by Sector11 (2010-06-28 19:58:33)


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#25 2010-06-28 20:40:57

Tunafish
#! Die Hard
From: the Netherlands
Registered: 2010-03-07
Posts: 1,204

Re: On a more sinister note: Are you afraid of Google?

It doesn't matter to me if i have something to hide or not... the question for me is why they (google, bing, the government, the rail company, the library, etc) want to keep all this information about me. If it's not important, why do they keep it?


sed 's/stress/relaxation/g'
Privacy & Security on #!

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