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#451 2012-03-25 09:49:24

gensym
#! Junkie
Registered: 2011-10-17
Posts: 447

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Sorry for not including this in my first post:

I use emacs, so C-t is not the best choice for the "chain-keybind-starter" sequence for me,
You can define a new one with

escape $chain

Last edited by gensym (2012-03-25 09:50:08)


'Multiple exclamation marks,' he went on, shaking his head, 'are a sure sign of a diseased mind.', {Eric}

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#452 2012-03-25 10:59:20

Iranon
#! Junkie
Registered: 2012-03-10
Posts: 254

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

2ManyDogs wrote:

^ thanks lowrider. Some of the ones you mentioned will definitely take a little longer to get a good look at. For example, I would be happy if someone who uses E17 everyday would write a review, but it's just too big and complicated for me to get a handle on in a short time, and I know I couldn't write a good review.

I understand and respect that, but it still makes me sad. I had hoped you'd tackle the full-featured/extensible ones after the focus on minimalism, but doing this well would probably would take more than a day for each.


LEGO won't be ready for the average user until it comes pre-assembled, in a single  unified look, and glued together so it doesn't come apart.

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#453 2012-03-25 12:26:09

dkeg
#! Die Hard
From: Mid-Atlantic Grill
Registered: 2011-12-05
Posts: 718

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

For my 100th post I want to let you know @2ManyDogs that this is truly epic what you're doing.  This is a thread that will go viral.  So far dwm and tmux seem the most intriguing to me.  Will you be reviewing awesome?
I have been playing with tmux a bit since you wrote about it, but just a tad.  I had finals this w/e.  I have a short break til I start school next Saturday, not work though unfortunately, and hopefully can spend some quality time messing around.

Last edited by dkeg (2012-03-25 12:27:59)


grill it | the rocky path may just be the best path

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#454 2012-03-25 12:28:33

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

gensym wrote:

Sorry for not including this in my first post:

I use emacs, so C-t is not the best choice for the "chain-keybind-starter" sequence for me,
You can define a new one with

escape $chain

Thanks. I forgot to mention that. I'll add it to the review.


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#455 2012-03-25 12:32:15

el_koraco
#!/loony/bun
From: inside Ed
Registered: 2011-07-25
Posts: 4,749

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

2ManyDogs wrote:

Thanks. I forgot to mention that. I'll add it to the review.

You'll add Emacs to the reviews? Good God man, you'll need a "30 years with the Gnu Desktop Environment" thread.

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#456 2012-03-25 13:28:11

AwesomeFist
#! Die Hard
From: Dungeons of Doom
Registered: 2011-01-02
Posts: 668

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

el_koraco wrote:
2ManyDogs wrote:

Thanks. I forgot to mention that. I'll add it to the review.

You'll add Emacs to the reviews? Good God man, you'll need a "30 years with the Gnu Desktop Environment" thread.

Oh you, el_koraco, what would this forum be like without you?

Last edited by AwesomeFist (2012-03-25 13:28:21)


"Of course it's happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?" -Albus Dumbledore

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#457 2012-03-25 17:37:44

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Day 21. After ten days of stackers and ten days of tilers, I'm going to bounce around a little for the last ten days, reviewing whatever I feel like at the moment. Today we are looking at another stacker, sithwm. Sithwm was based on evilwm, and you can see some similarities.

Sithwm is not in the repos, so it must be built. It's not difficult (especially nmow that we have gensym's how-to). You will have to create a .desktop file to make sithwm show up in the GDM sessions list. Refer to the flwm review for more information.

This is another one where you will want to read (and possibly print) the man page before you start it up. That's about all there is for documentation, but it's enough. When you start sithwm, you get a complete black screen. Right away we see one big difference between sithwm and evilwm -- because we read the man page we know we can bring up a menu with super+enter (I'm going to stop calling it the super key and call it the mod key now).

2012_03_25_070122_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

Because we are on a Debian system, we get the familiar auto-generated Debian menu. You can use it to select a terminal, or if you still have xbindkeys sithwm can work with that. Later we'll also see how to add bound keys without xbindkeys. Here is sithwm running with its default color scheme:

2012_03_25_093032_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

In the default scheme, active windows have a black border and inactive windows have a gray border. When you first activate a window, sithwm gives it a title bar just big enough to contain the window title, size, and location. This title bar disappears after a brief interval. Inactive windows have no title bar.

You can manipulate windows with the mouse by mod+left-click and drag to move, and mod+right-click and drag the lower-right corner to resize. Window focus follows the mouse, but active windows are not automatically raised to the top of the stack. You can raise a window with mod+left-click.

Like evilwm, sithwm has lots of bound keys for window movement, sizing, and activation. These are laid out in a logical format on the keyboard. For example, mod+e,x,s,d moves the active window up, down, left, or right. If you look at the keyboard you will see that the directions correspond to the way the keys are laid out on the keyboard. mod+shift+e,x,s,d resizes the window up, down, left, or right. Mod+w,r,z,c moves the window to the upper left, upper right, lower left, or lower right corner of the screen. Again, the position corresponds to the way the keys are laid out on the keyboard.

Mod+insert lowers the active window, and mod+i raises a focused window that is not already at the top of the stack. Pressing the caps lock key (or mod+q) cycles through the top three windows on the current desktop. Shift+caps lock (or mod+shift+q) cycles through all windows on the current desktop. Mod+escape deletes the active window (closing any running app); if this does not work, mod+shift+escape forces the active window closed.

By default, sithwm has nine virtual desktops. Mod+<n> where n is the desktop number switches to the appropriate desktop. Mod+shift+<n> sends the currently active window to the numbered desktop, but does not switch the view to that desktop. Mod+tab starts a dialog box that shows all windows on all desktops and allows you to cycle through them. If you select a window that is not on the current desktop, sithwm switches to that desktop. This dialog box also shows a small view of each desktop and allows you to select and switch to a desktop. Mod+caps lock also starts this dialog box, but it shows only the windows on the current desktop.

In this screenshot, I started the dialog with mod+tab. Luakit, thunar, and viewnior are running on desktop one, and sakura is running on desktop two:

2012_03_25_090950_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

To quit sithwm, you must kill the process ("pkill sithwm").

Configuration

By default, sithwm uses the super key as its mod key. This can be changed when sithwm runs with the -m command-line switch. Any command that may be used in the .sithwmrc file may also be used in the command line.

Sithwm uses a single configuration file and a menu definition file. When it starts, sithwm looks for the following files:

/etc/X11/sithwm/menudefs.hook
/usr/share/sithwm/default.sithwmrc
$HOME/.sithwmrc

The make install process creates the first two files. Copy the default.sithwmrc file to your home folder to modify it:

cp /usr/share/sithwm/default.sithwmrc ~/.sithwmrc

The default sithwmrc file contains definitions for all the key codes, a menu example, and color and font specifications. Key codes are built from commands, and these commands are documented in the man page. I'm not going to describe all the commands, but I'll show you what I changed so you can get an idea of how they work.

First, I set the window move to "outline" drag (I usually need to do this on my Celeron box), I changed the font used in the menu and title bar, and I changed the amount of time the title-bar stays up (I made it shorter than the default):

nosoliddrag
fn -*-terminus-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
pt1 100

I found all the places where the caps lock key was used and disabled them:

#key 0        Caps_Lock    circulate,focus,raise,set_view,mouse      3  200
#key std    Caps_Lock    next,focus,raise,mouse,popup,local
#key shift    Caps_Lock    circulate,focus,raise,set_view,mouse    299  0

I added some application-starting keys (mod+t starts sakura, alt+F3 and mod+F3 start dmenu, and mod+shift+w starts luakit):

key std        t        sh sakura
key std        F3        sh dmenu_run
key alt        F3        sh dmenu_run
key std,shift     w    sh luakit

I set F11 and F12 to raise and lower windows:

key 0        F12        raise
key 0        F11        lower

The "std" key is the standard modifier (super by default) and you can use it and the shift, alt, and control keys in any combination. "Key 0" means the key is used alone, with no modifier.

I set luakit to always start with a specific geometry (I wanted a large window mostly centered on the screen):

app luakit
geometry "1030x957+67+34"

I changed the focused border color to blue, and the other colors to black and white shades:

cf "blue"
cb "black"
cc "black"
ce "gray"
cg "#444444"
ch "#444444"
ci "white"

And I added a menu to the end of the existing menu. If you want to remove the Debian menu, you must rename /etc/X11/sithwm/menudefs.hook so sithwm doesn't load it (don't delete it; you might change your mind). I don't really use menus, so I added this just to see how it was done. It's very straightforward:

menu "dog menu"
    cmd terminal sakura
    cmd web luakit
    cmd files thunar
    menu apps
        cmd editor geany
        cmd fireweasel iceweasel
        cmd pix viewnior
        cmd ranger "terminator -e ranger"
        cmd moc "terminator -e mocp -T transparent-background"
    end
end

I also created a startup script so I could set a desktop background and run conky. refer again to the flwm review if you don't know how to make a startup script. Here's what it all looks like:

2012_03_25_090542_1280x1024_scrot.jpg  2012_03_24_163118_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

What I Like About It

It's almost as minimal as evilwm, but it's much easier to use and to configure. I like the tiny borders and that there's no title bar most of the time. I like that super is the default mod key and that it doesn't expect a three-button mouse.

What I Don't Like About It

Not much. If it used a different font for the menu and titlebar it would be easier to make a nicer-looking menu, but I don't really care. I wish it could reload its config file while it was running. The panels don't work with it, but panels are bloat smile

Links

"man sithwm"
sithwm home page

tomorrow, another tiler: euclid-wm
back to the top

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-26 18:25:30)


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#458 2012-03-26 18:20:08

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Day 22. We're going to look at another tiling window manager today, called euclid-wm. I wanted to review this one because it tiles in a slightly different way from the other tilers we're all used to.

Euclid-wm is not in the repos, but it is not difficult to build (I promise after today I'll get back to a few that are in the repos). The make-install process creates a .desktop file and copies it to /usr/share/xsessions, so this one shows up in GDM with no additional help.

Euclid-wm is keyboard driven; there are no mouse-bound commands, but window focus does follow mouse movement. Euclid-wm creates tiles in what it calls "tracks." It can create vertical tracks of tiles (new tiles are created below the active tile) or horizontal tracks (new tiles are created to the right of the active tile). The active tile has a blue border. By default euclid-wm uses the alt key as its mod key: alt+enter starts dmenu, and alt+shift+enter starts xterm. The track orientation can be changed from vertical to horizontal and back with alt+tab, but all tracks must have the same orientation. Here is a vertical track of three tiles:

2012_03_26_093821_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

You can create another track simply by moving one of the tiles to the left or right. Alt+shift+(h,l,j,k) moves the active tile right, left, up, or down. If I move the tile containing geany in the first screen, it looks like this:

2012_03_26_093917_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

Now there are two vertical tracks side-by-side. If I start another app with the geany window active, euclid-wm will create a new tile below it. Here I have started two more apps in the right-hand track and resized the tracks a little. You can create as many tracks as you like by moving tiles around the screen.

2012_03_26_094123_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

Another interesting feature of euclid-wm is its "stack" -- windows can be moved to the stack with the alt+. sequence and retrieved with the alt+, keys. Alt+/ swaps the active window with the currently focused stack window. Windows in the stack are hidden; when they are retrieved they are placed according to the currently active window (they may not return to the location where they were when they were added to the stack, unless the active window does not change). The list of windows in the stack is visible at the bottom of the desktop, and focus may be moved up and down in the stack to determine which window will be retrieved with the alt+, keys. In this screen shot, I have placed the bottom two windows in the right track into the stack. The window names are visible in the list at the bottom of the screen -- the highlighted window will be retrieved first:

2012_03_26_094225_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

If I move the focus to the top window in the left-hand track and retrieve the viewnior window, euclid-wm puts it below the active window (as if I had started a new app):

2012_03_26_111141_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

The stack list may be hidden (using alt+space), snd focus can be moved up and down in the stack to select the window that will be retrieved first.

Alt+shift+/ brings up a dmenu list of all currenly running windows, and allows you to select one:

2012_03_26_101611_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

If the selected window is in the stack, it is made visible. If the selected window is on a different desktop, that desktop is activated. Desktops are accessed with the alt+<n> sequence where <n> is a number from 1 to 9. Windows may be sent to a different desktop with the Alt+shift+<n> sequence. Alt+shift+space switches the active window into and out of full-screen mode, but euclid-wm does not handle floating windows. The home page says "No floating layer. (This is a feature.)"

Windows may be closed with Alt+Escape. Alt+Shift+Escape kills a window that is refusing to close. Alt+shift+q quits euclid-wm.

Configuration

All of euclid-wm's config information is contained in a single plain text file. The make-install process copies the default file to /usr/share/euclid-wm/euclid-wm.conf and ~/.config/euclid-wm/euclid-wm.conf. Modifications made to the local copy override the default. Euclid-wm also uses a file in the config folder called euclidrc as an "autostart" file -- this is a script file that is run by euclid-wm when it starts. The default copy is empty, but you can add things like conky and nitrogen.

I made the following changes to my euclid-wm.conf file. First, I changed the mod key to the windows key:

#MODKEY
#This is just a number, e.g, mod2 = 2. 
modkey = 4

I changed the active window border color to red (blue was too hard for me to see), and reserved a space at the top of the screen for conky:

color_main_focus = red
reserved_top = 18

The reserved space cannot be toggled on and off as with some other window managers.

I changed the key bindings for dmenu and xterm, and added one for luakit:

bind_spawn_menu = M p
dmenu = dmenu_run
bind_spawn_term = M t
term = sakura
bind_custom_01 = MS w
custom_command_01 = luakit

Euclid-wm supports up to 10 custom commands. Each can used to start external commands from bound keys.

I changed the focus and window movement commands to use the direction keys:

bind_focus_left = M Left
bind_focus_down = M Down
bind_focus_up = M Up
bind_focus_right = M Right

bind_shift_win_left = MS Left
bind_shift_win_down = MS Down
bind_shift_win_up = MS Up
bind_shift_win_right = MS Right

And I changed the commands that move windows to and from the stack so they make more sense to me (move down, move up):

bind_move_to_stack = MS d
bind_move_to_main = MS u

The mod+R sequence can be used to reload the config file while EU is running.

Here's what it looked like with these changes, conky and a window background:

2012_03_26_110204_1280x1024_scrot.jpg

Notice that windows in the left track can have completely diifferent sizes than the right track. Also notice that I have used up 72% of my root partition with window managers smile

What I Liked About It

It's simple. It's different. It doesn't have a lot of commands I don't use. It can reload its config file while it is running. You can create a lot of different layouts. I liked the stack concept. It can leave space for conky.

What I Didn't Like About It

It's not very intuitive (at least for me). I had to think about where I was putting windows and where the next window would end up when I started an app or retrieved a window from the stack. The conky space cannot be toggled while euclid-wm is running.

Links

"man euclid-wm"
euclid-wm home page

tomorrow, another stacker: oroborus
back to the top

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-27 16:57:30)


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#459 2012-03-26 20:10:30

kri5
#! Die Hard
From: L.G.C. UK
Registered: 2011-11-10
Posts: 568

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

@2ManyDogs.. This is going back a few but how did you get the conky working in Musca?

http://postimage.org/image/ra3zqujb5/

By the way great review on euclid-wm, looks like a contender if I can't configure the conky on Musca.  I would prefer Musca as I'm getting use to it now.


#! Waldorf - 64bit - Xfce

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#460 2012-03-26 20:20:34

PackRat
#! Die Hard
From: USA
Registered: 2011-03-03
Posts: 1,304

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Nice write up on a pretty obscure wm.


"It does not require many words to speak the truth." - Chief Joseph, Nez Perce tribe

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#461 2012-03-26 20:43:35

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

kri5 wrote:

@2ManyDogs.. This is going back a few but how did you get the conky working in Musca?

http://postimage.org/image/ra3zqujb5/

By the way great review on euclid-wm, looks like a contender if I can't configure the conky on Musca.  I would prefer Musca as I'm getting use to it now.

That's musca running in floating mode, where you can see the desktop. Most of the time it runs with frames obscuring the desktop, so even if you run conky you can't see it. To make it leave an area for conky, you have to set some padding. This has to be done every time you start a group, but you can hook it on to the add command in .musca_start:

hook on add pad 0 0 15 0

add one
add two
add web
add code

use one

You can also bind keys to open and close enough space at the top of the screen for conky:

bind on mod4+shift+d pad 0 0 15 0
bind on mod4+shift+u pad 0 0 0 0

So mod+shift+d shows the gap and mod+shift+u hides it (I don't remember if these keys were bound to something important before, so you might have to change them). Then just run a simple one-line conky across the top (put all the text on one line, and alignment top_middle,  gap_x 0, gap_y 2.
Put this in .musca_start, after "use one"

exec conky -c /path/to/your/one-line-conkyrc

Let me know if that doesn't work.

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-26 22:05:50)


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#462 2012-03-27 00:08:36

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Anybody out there? the thread has gone >15k views, but few responses. You all think I've gone off the deep end?

I promise one from the repos tomorrow...

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-27 00:09:18)


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#463 2012-03-27 00:15:17

damo
#! gimpbanger
From: N51.5 W002.8 (mostly)
Registered: 2011-11-24
Posts: 3,105

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^I'm still here for a bit, but I'm just skimming over these tilers cos they aren't for me smile

Fascinating journey though, thank you!


Artwork at deviantArt;  Iceweasel Personas;  SLiM #! Themes;  Openbox themes

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#464 2012-03-27 00:19:24

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^thanks. I was a little worried when my post today immediately followed yesterday's review...

(edit) you'll get a stacker tomorrow and wednesday smile

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-27 00:41:52)


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#465 2012-03-27 01:18:39

ivanovnegro
Ivan #000000
From: unstable madness
Registered: 2011-06-02
Posts: 5,426

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Still here, no worries. Even compiled DWM, hehe, you see @el K, I am not that anti-compile. Will see if I can make it useful for me or not. At the moment it is a ghost behind Spectrer.

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#466 2012-03-27 01:31:04

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^ thanks Ivan. I still have scrot/spectrwm as my default on my main box, so I'm not sold yet...

Good job trying DWM --it is but a ghost behind spectrwm...


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#467 2012-03-27 01:42:53

apprentice
#! Member
From: 43°42′N - 79°23′W
Registered: 2012-02-04
Posts: 85

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^and great job to you on your 30/30 2MD

i came across this pclos mag today while doing some www'ing

it seems to be a half-decent reference
that is if anyone uses openbox after your done your tour

i just dont know where it should go

keep up the good work

next project???


So come up to the lab...
And see what's on the slab

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#468 2012-03-27 01:44:49

ivanovnegro
Ivan #000000
From: unstable madness
Registered: 2011-06-02
Posts: 5,426

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

@2ManyWMs: Yeah, DWM is fun and I quite like it, but for the moment, Spectrer is still the winner on my box.

I only know one thing after using a tiler since December, there is no way back to a DE or something else. smile Xfce also finally died on my main box. It will only stay on my work machine, others have access to that one.

Last edited by ivanovnegro (2012-03-27 01:45:22)

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#469 2012-03-27 02:21:04

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^ if I had any part in killing Xfce on your main machine, I am happy smile


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#470 2012-03-27 02:46:25

ivanovnegro
Ivan #000000
From: unstable madness
Registered: 2011-06-02
Posts: 5,426

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^ smile. Unfortunately not. I removed it weeks ago.

But you sure are guilty that I play with the mo**er fecker DWM.

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#471 2012-03-27 03:07:15

dkeg
#! Die Hard
From: Mid-Atlantic Grill
Registered: 2011-12-05
Posts: 718

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

so far I have remained in openbox using tmux.  pretty happy so far.  works out too, cause was finally happy with my setup so sort of just gave me the best of both worlds.

also psyched cause aced my final and class.  No rest for the weary though, new class starts up Saturday.


grill it | the rocky path may just be the best path

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#472 2012-03-27 03:10:21

2ManyDogs
dv#!
From: elsewhere
Registered: 2011-11-22
Posts: 1,346

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

^congratulations dkeg!

I am really surprised at how many people liked the tmux review. I thought I'd get hate mail because it's not really an X window manager...

I'll do dvtm before the end of the series for sure now.

Last edited by 2ManyDogs (2012-03-27 03:10:54)


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#473 2012-03-27 03:13:40

ivanovnegro
Ivan #000000
From: unstable madness
Registered: 2011-06-02
Posts: 5,426

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

2ManyDogs wrote:

I thought I'd get hate mail because it's not really an X window manager...

We are not a Orange Forums. big_smile

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#474 2012-03-27 06:12:02

SabreWolfy
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2009-03-09
Posts: 1,285

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Still here. This thread is legendary smile I don't have time to go through it all in detail at the moment, so it will be an awesome resource/reference in the future too.

Last edited by SabreWolfy (2012-03-27 06:12:33)


Support #!Waldorf • Debian sid • Xubuntu • siduction • Peppermint • OpenBox • Xfce • LXDE •

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#475 2012-03-27 07:22:14

Athos
#! CrunchBanger
Registered: 2011-09-28
Posts: 108

Re: 30 Window Managers in 30 days

Awesome, with that name, sithwm, has to be epic...
May I suggest you to review the epic window manager FVWM?

As far as I know, it's a hard one to configure, but also offers great rewards for those who manage to configure it...
What do you think??

PS: I'm proud of my playlist (I mean, it's in THE WM definitive thread!) big_smile

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