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#1 2012-10-10 00:33:02

merelyjim
#! Die Hard
From: Fort Worth, Texas
Registered: 2010-04-07
Posts: 2,303
Website

Windows 8 Guinea Pig

So, because of work, I'm running the Release Preview of Windows 8. [The inner Jim is swearing like you wouldn't believe!!!]

For all intents and purposes, I'm the Guinea Pig. Might as well document what I've learned. Might prove useful elsewhere.

# Unetbootin doesn't work for Windows 8. You have to get a special version from Microsoft at http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/mss … vd_dwnTool to burn the ISO to a flash-drive.

# The Windows 8 Release Preview ISO images can be found here, http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-8/iso and they're freakin' huge! 2.5GB for 32-bit and 4.something for 64-bit. Make a note of the ACTIVATION CODE before you go any further - it's the first thing that's asked for...

# The install takes about a half-hour. You'll be asked for a Hotmail, Outlook, or Windows Live account before the damn thing will run. Not a problem, exactly, but as soon as you link into the net, your Win8 machine integrates into *everything* you've used that e-mail with! Facebook, Twitter, MySpace - everything. Get ready for your Live Tiles to display embarrassing Viagra Spam during public gatherings...

# Used my netbook [an Acer D250] for the install. No way was I going to use a mission critical machine for the purposes of Microsoft! But the Windows 7 , and 8, driver for the graphic chipset wasn't enough to work the Live Tiles. They just sit there and do nothing until you switch to the Desktop view and get your stuff done there.

# Windows Defender is installed by default. They really want you to get everything through the Microsoft Store, and while they don't disable you ability to install open source programs, Internet Explorer 10 makes it known that if it doesn't come from Microsoft, maybe you shouldn't be trust it. neutral

# Going to install a dual-boot with #! tonight, but so far, don't see any trouble. Aside from a MASSIVE face-lift, Windows 8 appears to be the same basic structure as Windows 7.

# Really want to hate this product. I want to say that this OS is as bad as Vista or WinME. But that's just not true, from what I've seen. It's pretty. It's as fast as can be expected. And it's going to have the same interface on Desktops, Laptops, Tablets, and Phones. Even if I hated it as much as I want to, the rest of the world is stuck with iApple, or this. I'd love to tell you this is a piece of excrement, but so far, it seems pretty good.

# Like hell I'm paying for it, though! As soon as the trial period comes up, and they ask for a compulsory donation of... whatever Microsoft feels it's worth, I'm firing up gparted and wiping that crap off my machine.

# Anyway, just thought I'd let you-all know what's coming. Obviously, no conflicts with Secure Boot or viruses, but it's going to hit the stores in a few months, and you should know about it...


"When I enter a command... I expect ass to be hauled and the coffeelike aroma of hustle delicately hovering in the air." -thalassophile

My attempt at a blog; http://waitingonragnarok.blogspot.com/

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Be excellent to each other!

#2 2012-10-10 07:09:24

mariannemarlow
#! Die Hard
From: My flat, London, England
Registered: 2012-06-03
Posts: 2,204
Website

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

Hey Jim

Nice review!

This really made me laugh "Get ready for your Live Tiles to display embarrassing Viagra Spam during public gatherings..."

big_smile


Between two evils, I always pick the one I never tried before ~ Mae West

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#3 2012-10-10 07:17:15

corenominal
WRONG
From: Lincoln, UK
Registered: 2008-11-20
Posts: 5,037
Website

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

A couple of months ago, I tried one of the preview images, so I feel your pain. big_smile

merelyjim wrote:

# The install takes about a half-hour. You'll be asked for a Hotmail, Outlook, or Windows Live account before the damn thing will run.

I could be wrong, but I think it is possible to skip this step, although it was not made obvious. Interestingly, a lot of operating systems seem to be moving in this direction. Android comes to mind, and even GNOME 3, whilst not as deeply integrated, has some online account options. Personally, I am not sure how I feel about this, I can see some benefits, but I am not sure they outweigh the negatives. hmm

driver for the graphic chipset wasn't enough to work the Live Tiles. They just sit there and do nothing until you switch to the Desktop view and get your stuff done there.

You did not miss much. I quite liked the metro animations and it worked smoothly, but I was testing on a desktop machine and I found most of the metro applications to be a PITA. That said, I guess it would work quite well on a tablet?!

# Windows Defender is installed by default.

I think this is what did it for me. I inserted a USB flash drive and Windows Defender (at least I think it was Windows Defender that was responsible) automatically deleted some files on the drive. I was gobsmacked! Apparently, you can turn this "feature" off, but still, WTF?

# Going to install a dual-boot with #! tonight, but so far, don't see any trouble. Aside from a MASSIVE face-lift, Windows 8 appears to be the same basic structure as Windows 7.

That was the exact same impression I was left with. I am glad I tried it for myself, but I really do pity anyone who has to actually work with it.

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#4 2012-10-10 08:48:30

buri
Member
Registered: 2012-05-30
Posts: 23

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

merelyjim wrote:

# Windows Defender is installed by default.

This is good free antyvirus program becouse it's MSE (Microsoft Security Essentials) (they only change name).


Archbang x86
Very very poor english

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#5 2012-10-10 09:47:51

gutterslob
#! Resident Bum
Registered: 2009-11-03
Posts: 2,924

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

merelyjim wrote:

# Going to install a dual-boot with #! tonight, but so far, don't see any trouble. Aside from a MASSIVE face-lift, Windows 8 appears to be the same basic structure as Windows 7.

What about that whole locked bootloader/EFI thing MS supposedly mandate? I know there was some Red Hat dev twisting his knickers about it some months ago. Apologies for the ignorance. I haven't exactly been keeping up with the times.


Point & Squirt

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#6 2012-10-10 11:16:23

merelyjim
#! Die Hard
From: Fort Worth, Texas
Registered: 2010-04-07
Posts: 2,303
Website

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

^ The Secure Boot, UEFI-thing is only on new machines, and my netbook is a few years old, so no conflict.


"When I enter a command... I expect ass to be hauled and the coffeelike aroma of hustle delicately hovering in the air." -thalassophile

My attempt at a blog; http://waitingonragnarok.blogspot.com/

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#7 2012-10-10 16:57:34

Cope57
#! Member
From: /home
Registered: 2009-01-20
Posts: 94

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

Hey merelyjim,

I have been testing out the Windows 8 Developers Preview Edition since August  2011, and the wow factor came and went the first hour using it.  It is a pain to use, but may be useful when it is integrated into a Microsoft tablet.  The icons, or tabs as Microsoft likes to call them can be moved using a touch screen, just like current phone apps.

My testbed has been my laptop, which is a HP Pavillion 6900 series.  The laptop became a testbed almost the day I purchased it.  It came with Windows Vista, and I immediately made a backup of the OS onto CD's (cd's are all I had at the time).  Sixteen cd's later I had it backed up.  I have been installing different Linux distributions since.  I tried crunchbang on it long ago, and even mentioned it somewhere in the forum.

So, the Windows Developer Preview had a new update a couple months back which enabled the OS to be extended to March.  I told others about the update, and thinking that the Preview should end before the actual released version, I assumed that Windows 8 was not going to be released until next year.  As for actual release dates, only Microsoft knows.  They have never been able to stick to a release date that I know of.. Oh, wait, Millennium edition they rushed the OS to be out on time, that did not turn out well.

In my opinion of Windows releases they have been something like this:

1.0 good
2.0 bad
2.1 good
3.0 bad
3.1 good
3.11 better
95 good a gui version
98 bad
98 SE good
Millennium bad
XP good
Vista bad
7 good (Vista with a service pack, and greedy M$ sold it to the people)
8 ???

I see a slight pattern here, do you?

Never mind my ranting, I will never purchase another Microsoft product.  Linux now has my soul, if all distributions become to popular like *buntu, I will switch to BSD. wink


( o< -Penguins rule!
/ /\
V_/_
Computers do not have problems, they have users. ~Cope57

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#8 2012-10-11 01:51:41

merelyjim
#! Die Hard
From: Fort Worth, Texas
Registered: 2010-04-07
Posts: 2,303
Website

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

Just a quick update;

Installed #! with a dual-boot in mind - the netbook system resources were just enough to run Win8, but not get anything useful done with it - but GRUB failed to see the Windows partition. I was going to go in and try to fix it when a small, but very persistent, voice in the back of my head told me this was The Will Of The Tech Gods In Action. *

Windows 8 is very pretty without really changing much. Like Unity on Ubuntu, it's obviously made for touch, but unlike Unity after October 26th (here in the US) when you buy a computer, it's going to just be there. It was useful to play with it for a few hours to understand the UI, but I'm going to take functional over pretty every time.

It was also pretty hard to miss the Microsoft Store, similar to the Apple App Store, where you could buy and download software directly from Microsoft, everything therein guaranteed to run on Windows 8. When I did a Bing search for Open Office, because I felt I should be able to at least write something on the damn machine, I was directed to a site that offered something very much like Open Office, but it wanted permission to change my default search engine to something.us - gotta be a Trojan. Pulled down the real thing from Apache's site, but get ready for the scare-factor campaign.

Anyway, a quick reboot/reinstall, and I'm back running #! smile

So: Windows 8 - doesn't completely suck. Just has that Microsoft handicap going for it.

* Note to self; need to trademark that slogan for use later...

Last edited by merelyjim (2012-10-11 01:52:27)


"When I enter a command... I expect ass to be hauled and the coffeelike aroma of hustle delicately hovering in the air." -thalassophile

My attempt at a blog; http://waitingonragnarok.blogspot.com/

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#9 2012-10-11 08:13:22

corenominal
WRONG
From: Lincoln, UK
Registered: 2008-11-20
Posts: 5,037
Website

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

merelyjim wrote:

So: Windows 8 - doesn't completely suck. Just has that Microsoft handicap going for it.

Seems like a fair judgement smile

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#10 2012-10-11 13:56:56

root
#! CrunchBanger
From: Capital of Culture
Registered: 2010-11-11
Posts: 169

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

@Cope57

You forgot the best Windows of them all.
Win2000
It was the last windows I had installed on my machine.



/

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#11 2012-10-11 22:27:08

iamnutz
#! Member
Registered: 2012-07-27
Posts: 55

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

Sad part is yes, looks like the OS scene is going to change with or without us mostly due to the expansive use of tablets/smartphones. Win 8 can be customised howeve you like it. Also, if you understand the registry and the winNT kernel you can pwn your win OS.I have a vista partition than runs like win2k-pro and looks like win7,there's sooooo many tweaks it gets insane.But I will say as HD as win8 looked, #! looks just as good if not even a bit glassy-er on this old acer. But,, hardware is moving forward and so is the OS...at least we have a choice while most people will be stuck with what they get right?

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#12 2012-10-11 22:36:22

merelyjim
#! Die Hard
From: Fort Worth, Texas
Registered: 2010-04-07
Posts: 2,303
Website

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

Thing is we all have that one friend or relative that looks to us for support...


"When I enter a command... I expect ass to be hauled and the coffeelike aroma of hustle delicately hovering in the air." -thalassophile

My attempt at a blog; http://waitingonragnarok.blogspot.com/

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#13 2012-10-11 23:53:31

Dyzphagia
#! CrunchBanger
From: Ft. Bliss, TX
Registered: 2011-10-06
Posts: 166

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

I've had the Windows 8 RTM installed since around early August. I've actually come to enjoy the lower system footprint and the new start screen.

Some of the apps are really nice and with the lower footprint, some of my games run better. Though if I'm going to be doing any actual work, it'll be on my linux machine. Though I'm just hoping that they'll eventually allow an option to go back to regular start screen sometime and metro or whatever it's called now, is just another option.

Though it's not a huge problem, I don't notice it most of the time since the screen is filled with video games


"You either die a hero, or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain." - Cyber Steve Jobs

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#14 2012-10-13 09:23:54

merelyjim
#! Die Hard
From: Fort Worth, Texas
Registered: 2010-04-07
Posts: 2,303
Website

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

@gutterslob

News on the whole Secure Boot SNAFU. smile

http://www.geek.com/articles/news/linux … -20121012/


"When I enter a command... I expect ass to be hauled and the coffeelike aroma of hustle delicately hovering in the air." -thalassophile

My attempt at a blog; http://waitingonragnarok.blogspot.com/

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#15 2012-10-13 14:40:24

jmad2011
#! Junkie
From: newton falls ohio
Registered: 2011-12-25
Posts: 333

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

^ that article made it sound like, "Well hey i'm gonna put this disk full of malware in and boot my computer with it." sounds like M$ is using the malware "song" so they can be the only band playing in the arena.


Say your prayer's,Eat your vitamins....AND WHAT YOU GONNA DO BROTHA

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#16 2012-10-13 14:42:22

merelyjim
#! Die Hard
From: Fort Worth, Texas
Registered: 2010-04-07
Posts: 2,303
Website

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

Yup... microsoftspeak.


"When I enter a command... I expect ass to be hauled and the coffeelike aroma of hustle delicately hovering in the air." -thalassophile

My attempt at a blog; http://waitingonragnarok.blogspot.com/

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#17 2012-10-13 15:24:38

pvsage
Internal Affairs
From: North Carolina
Registered: 2009-10-18
Posts: 11,446

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

The Linux Foundation wrote:

What the foundation plans to do is to obtain a Microsoft Key that can then be used to create a pre-bootloader.

Snowball's chance in hell? hmm


Yes; as a matter of fact, I am a cop.  Why do you ask? cool
I'm a moderator here.  How are we doing?  Feedback is encouraged.

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#18 2012-10-14 02:04:35

gutterslob
#! Resident Bum
Registered: 2009-11-03
Posts: 2,924

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

Well, from what I can comprehend, and please correct me if I'm mistaken here, you only need a signed key if you plan to dual-boot, right?

I tend to keep my work (OS X) and home computers separate anyway. So, as long as I have a x86 machine/mobo that allows me to disable secure boot, I should be able to just install whatever OS I want over the whole drive, curing cancer (ie. wiping Windows) in the process, right?


Point & Squirt

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#19 2012-10-14 08:55:07

joek
#! Junkie
Registered: 2011-09-06
Posts: 495

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

@gutterslob: that was my understanding too. Then again, plans may have changed since I last read about the plan...

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#20 2012-10-14 09:13:23

vicshrike
#! by Default
From: /14.04
Registered: 2009-02-13
Posts: 2,914

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

UEFI Secure Boot downgraded to PITA;

http://www.itworld.com/it-managementstr … raded-pita


#!, all else is but a shadow

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#21 2012-10-14 10:26:45

el_koraco
#!/loony/bun
From: inside Ed
Registered: 2011-07-25
Posts: 4,747

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

gutterslob wrote:

So, as long as I have a x86 machine/mobo that allows me to disable secure boot, I should be able to just install whatever OS I want over the whole drive, curing cancer (ie. wiping Windows) in the process, right?

All x86 machines must allow for secure boot to be disabled, as per the MS certification scheme.

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#22 2012-10-14 11:01:46

ew
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2012-09-27
Posts: 1,975

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

merelyjim wrote:

# Really want to hate this product. I want to say that this OS is as bad as Vista or WinME. But that's just not true, from what I've seen. It's pretty. It's as fast as can be expected. And it's going to have the same interface on Desktops, Laptops, Tablets, and Phones. Even if I hated it as much as I want to, the rest of the world is stuck with iApple, or this. I'd love to tell you this is a piece of excrement, but so far, it seems pretty good.

Pretty? Those lego-tiles? No way. Metro is a step in the wrong direction, just like Unity is with Ubuntu. W8 is fast and relatively ligh on resources, and boots a lot faster than previous MS-OS, but Metro is butt ugly, counter-productive and counter-intiutive when using it with mouse and keyboard on larger screen. It`s obviouse that this is an attempt to force the majority of pc-users over to "Metro", so that most people will relate W8 to smartphones, and therefore perhaps will be more likely to buy a windows-phone/tab. Metro works fine as a touch-gui, but should have been a choise for people with touch screens, and or other mobile devices. It should not have been integrated into the OS like it is.

Thirdparty software like Classic Shell can give you the menus and the start button back, and enable you to boot right up to the "Desktop", without having to boot into metro at all. But it kind of provoces me that MS haven`t provided this option themselves. Metro is the reason why I`m migrating into LInux after more than 30 years with MS. I just hate the whole consept of touch-screens on laptop`s. On a tab it feels natural, but on a pc? Stretching your arms out to touch the screen? It`s an egonomical disaster. If I wanted the workout, then I rather would play WII:)


- Vacant account

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#23 2012-10-14 14:22:29

iamnutz
#! Member
Registered: 2012-07-27
Posts: 55

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

^^ good point but if one were to dig deeper they will find options in "group policy" to change/modify win8 screens wink
I had mine boot to a login screen and then right to the search panel with the nice list of all programs, even easier than the old start button where ya have to click-click-click to get to programs..... no scrolling,no stretching, it was all there including programs I installed....automatically dropped in. As far as boot, I saved a old program called bootitng that includes a (E)MBR script to deploy an img to any partition I set up in the EMBR boot loader which I believe will bypass the secure boot thingie whilst still providing win8 OS on newer machines..... I'll play with that when it all happens

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#24 2012-10-14 14:31:59

iamnutz
#! Member
Registered: 2012-07-27
Posts: 55

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

BTW, everything I know or dont know in the computer world I've had to teach myself as I never had the luxury of any schooling after H.S., so if I dont make perfect sense that's why big_smile . I would have loved growing up in this last generation.

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#25 2012-10-14 15:10:02

joek
#! Junkie
Registered: 2011-09-06
Posts: 495

Re: Windows 8 Guinea Pig

@Iamnutz - growing up in this generation wouldn't have helped. I finished secondary school in the UK in June (currently first year at university) and our computer education was somewhere between hopelessly inadequate and utterly non-existent. Next generation might begin to get some... (IDK what it's like elsewhere, though...)

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